Transcript

save as many trees as we can. Thank you. Yes, thank you. Yeah, there's no proposals to fell any trees as part of this development and there's a further condition proposed, which I'm trying to find a number of it now, but basically it requires each further application that will come forward to submit tree documentation of how the individual elements might affect trees in that particular part of the site. But the way the indicative massive times being drawn up in theory there should be no loss of trees proposed and if there were any potential loss and potential proposed felling of trees or impact on the tree protection root protection area or something like that will be covered at the reserve matters stage. Of course probably something would be encouraging when that does come around because we obviously want to protect those. I can see no other hand so we'll now move directly into the debate. Now usually it's the person who's award the schemes within or the one that's nearest. It would not be appropriate for me to leave debate as I'm chairing this meeting and so therefore and I have indicated to her previously that I would be doing this. I'm going to Councillor Moss as the nearest Councillor to this site apart from me. Thank you chair. I've been making some notes throughout this conversation so far. So to sum up then, I can see that the application site is allocated for housing under LPS 36 and that 30% of this will be provided as affordable homes for local families which I fully support because there are simply not enough affordable homes in this affluent area and myself I live in an affordable home and that's allowed me to stay in my area. So I welcome that. I've listened to the medical practice requirements and I agree that the allocated funds from the S-186 are allocated to the developments but I'm pleased that Nick Holland has confirmed that this will be the case and it will be stipulated. I've noticed that the report states that schools can handle the increase in capacity which has also been mentioned today and I also note that I welcome the proposed funding for the SEND provision. It is frustrating why we can't have the infrastructure delivered before development. I recognise that. I recognise the issues with the roads in Knutsford but I also understand it's not always possible and I welcome the contribution of 1.3 million to the active travel scheme along the A50 King Edward Road and the link into the new roundabout scheme being delivered at Canute Square roundabout which is stipulated in the report and this will help to resolve the current infrastructure issues locally in the long term admittedly not straight away. Finally I would also like to urge the applicant to review the allocation allotment provision in the area not necessarily on site I recognise that might not be possible but given that they are the majority landowner in the area locally I believe that there are other areas not necessarily in Knutsford but across the whole of the Tatton estate which would be welcomed by locals and so I urge the estate to review that. I personally don't see any issues massively with this application I've stated where my concerns are and I would look to support an approval but I will listen to comments from my colleagues. Who else would like to take part in this debate? Councillor Garnett. Sorry, Councillor Marshall. Thank you Chair. It's listening to what's going on and the officers will always come back with an answer as to why we can't do something or how it's being done the right way. I'm not convinced on the answers that I've heard about why we can't have a playing field on this site and that's given me cause for concern as to why that might be the case. I think probably the case is that a playing field would be far more expensive than just ponds and life so I didn't ask the office for an answer to my question because I knew I'd get an answer to say you know forget that it's not going to happen the money's going to be spent somewhere else but I really find that difficult and I find it difficult actually to vote for this on that basis. Councillor Edgar. Thank you Chair. I think we need to look at this whole application in the round. It ain't perfect, there never will be perfect but I did have some concerns with the application and with the comments made my objectors but my overall feeling is I think I'll move to approve it. It's had a lot of advantages it's in the local plan. I'll move to approve. Councillor Moss. Okay before I move to the vote and I would like to say something myself as a rule councillor. So I recognize that this is a site that will have houses built on it. I fully understand that when it says 250 or around 250 there will be some slippage shall we say because and across the we will all look at sites those of you are new and occasionally they are under provided because we can't get the number that has been allocated on there and more often than not there are a few extra but that does actually benefit the area is the whole of the borough because it does mean that it's a part of the reason why a five-year housing land supply is looking so healthy now and the longest standing members will all know about the times when we didn't have a house but by the housing land supply and every field across particularly in the south of the borough became fair game for developers to build new houses on so I don't have too many concerns about as having a total of up to 270 units when the thing comes forward however I am concerned that the provision of a care or nursing home on the site may have ramifications for the wider council and I would like a informative put on to any decision with regard to that which specifies that the there should be prior discussions between the developer before submitting the reserve matters application with the council's director of adult social care or an alternative appropriate officer who she may delegate to to ensure that what is provided on this side is not going to present problems further down the line for the wider council and that this is an appropriate site to provide such a facility within there will be people in the market who quite readily want to provide these homes particularly north of the borough because they can charge exceedingly high returns for them and however we have to look at the borough as a whole we have a strategic planning board we must make sure that the location of any such care or nursing homes is appropriate for the whole borough and not just to meet a market demand I share Councillor Garnett's concern but there are not there is no provision of a sports pitch on this site and I think that I would urge the applicants to review this and to potentially come up with in their reserve matter scheme with open space that is accessible we are providing a site which will have a significant number of family homes on family homes by their very nature are occupied by children children need somewhere to play and that shouldn't be restricted on the amount of income that you have if you are going to be living in one of the family homes that are going to be affordable it's highly probable but your incomes may not facilitate you being able to pay for your children to go to these pay clubs in mutsford they're not cheap therefore I think it's appropriate that there is somewhere for all children to be able to play also if we believe in social cohesion actually the children from the social housing should be paying the children from the non-social housing and that can that that if they've got to pay to go to the club down the road that doesn't lead to social cohesion so I'd last ask you you to review please similarly I would ask I would share councillor Moses position if you are unable to provide allotments on this side there is a need for further allotments and I would ask that your client look at perhaps another patch of land in the in nutsford to provide some the appropriate level of an allotment storage and I'm pleased to hear that the access is coming off of onto Manchester Road that's not evident in the planning application I know we've got an indicative layout which shows it but it's not evident and I was concerned that we would have issues with regards to traffic going on to near Heath Lane I do hope however that when the scheme comes forward there will be cycle and pedestrian access onto near Heath Lane because that's an essential so I think on balance I hear what is being said by the representatives from the community group I understand their frustrations however we are if we do not approve this scheme eight it will go to appeal and because it's an allocated site it will be approved probably without some of the benefits that with the our personnel to accrue because inspectors by their very nature do not like lists of conditions and they scratch half of them out so it would it wouldn't be in the interest of the people of nuts and all the people who are going to live in these houses for that to be the case so therefore I've set my piece the proposal has been proposed and seconded and so it counts regular to come back I agree with what you've been saying with regards to the recommendations to the development thank you very much so it's been proposed and seconded so I can I have a show all those in favor of approving the scheme please one two three four five six seven eight nine ten and those against one one Jewish that to be recorded council Marshall yes okay thank you very much right that's the end of that item I propose that we have a five-minute break for people to use the facilities or make a coffee can we be all back at 22 that's slightly more than five minutes please hold your meeting has been temporarily adjourned please hold your meeting has been temporarily adjourned you please hold your meeting has been temporarily adjourned please hold your meeting has been temporarily adjourned you please hold your meeting has been temporarily adjourned please hold your meeting has been temporarily adjourned you please hold your meeting has been temporarily adjourned please hold your meeting has been temporarily adjourned you please hold your meeting has been temporarily adjourned please hold your meeting has been temporarily adjourned you please hold your meeting has been temporarily adjourned please hold your meeting has been temporarily adjourned you please hold your meeting has been temporarily adjourned please hold your meeting has been temporarily adjourned you please hold your meeting has been temporarily adjourned please hold your meeting has been temporarily adjourned you please hold your meeting has been temporarily adjourned please hold your meeting has been temporarily adjourned you please hold your meeting has been temporarily adjourned please hold your meeting has been temporarily adjourned you please hold your meeting has been temporarily adjourned please hold your meeting has been temporarily adjourned you please hold your meeting has been temporarily adjourned please hold your meeting has been temporarily adjourned you please hold your meeting has been temporarily adjourned please hold your meeting has been temporarily adjourned you please hold your meeting has been temporarily adjourned please hold your meeting has been temporarily adjourned you please hold your meeting has been temporarily adjourned please hold your meeting has been temporarily adjourned you please hold your meeting has been temporarily adjourned please hold your meeting has been temporarily adjourned you please hold your meeting has been temporarily adjourned please hold your meeting has been temporarily adjourned you please hold your meeting has been temporarily adjourned please hold your meeting has been temporarily adjourned you please hold your meeting has been temporarily adjourned please hold your meeting has been temporarily adjourned you please hold your meeting has been temporarily adjourned please hold your meeting has been temporarily adjourned you please hold your meeting has been temporarily adjourned please hold your meeting has been temporarily adjourned you please hold your meeting has been temporarily adjourned please hold your meeting has been temporarily adjourned you please hold your meeting has been temporarily adjourned please hold your meeting has been temporarily adjourned you please hold your meeting has been temporarily adjourned so we will go on to item six which is application two three of the zero five three nine n land in the western part of basford east crew full planning commission for units one to three comprising a mix of class B to e brackets G brackets three light industrial and manufacturing and b8 warehousing and distribution uses and ancillary areas together with access car parking provision landscaping including buffers habitat parks nature trails sustainable drainage features ponds whales and rain gardens ecological enhancements wet meadows woodland planting wildflower grassland and other associated works and infrastructure proposed within the northern part of the site within the curtain of the curtledge of units one to three plus outline planning permission for the southern part of the site comprising a mix of classes e brackets G brackets one offices b2 slash e brackets G bracket black brackets three light industrial stroke manufacturing and b8 warehousing and distribution uses with all matters reserved including access appearance landscape layout and scale together with works and infrastructure associated with the southern part of the site this application can be found on pages 71 to 126 of your agenda pack earlier I made reference to Richard Taylor he is now with us and I will ask him to introduce the item please this is the location part of the site very large effectively greenfield site includes mature trees hedgerows and ponds the Western boundary joins runs up to the western batteries here and runs up to the main west main railway line the southern boundary of the embankment of the a 500 which crosses the northern boundary gents and joins an area woodland which also is a mere gutter and bastard brook or local wildlife site and importantly over here is the tail wimpy proposal is a TW residential site which runs on both sides of this access road which leads from the main spine road into this development and also serves the TW site on the other side this is the allocated site as a strategic allocation this falls part of the site expand about here see the site stands David Whitby way residential areas on this side as well and basically it's important provision employment development is stated as the principle and overriding objective of us this is hybrid application and that's explained in the description should I don't know the chair comprises two components which will refer to later the orange is the fully detailed bit of the application and the blue is the outline component and effectively all details are reserved for future approval the full component has three employment units equating to around about seventy three square so it simply thousand square meters of the b2b8 and light industrial use and the outline area similarly as those abuses plus it will have an office component as well as I said before all matters in here are indicative and would be subject to future approval although the outline proposed are supported by a series of parameters plans and a design code this gives you an idea of a wider context sorry about the arrow it's our site in here and again it shows the wider context and you can see they've opened it to the south they would be to the right-hand side here Western Road industrial areas and importantly the bass for the West strategic site here which is a series of industrial units not dissimilar size slightly nowhere on this side railway here also you can see crew hall over here and the village of Western this is a taken from the applicant's supporting statement but it gives you an idea again of context and you can see it's pretty slightly older it says it shows the sort of nature of the uses surrounding boundaries beside the 500 itself and the residential site to the right-hand side and a view from the a500 bridge this is taken from the street view I didn't take it myself but again it gives you an idea of the current context besides you can see the railway side is the floodlight pylons and the nature the site itself was so this is coming from the spine of the site I was talking about the TW site on the eastern side of the site it's fine those already in and this is just looking into the site entrance here you can see some houses are going up now there is a significant stand-off in the row the about 50 meters back as you might show it there and again looking back the way it's going back to David would be way so this is the main access which will serve the table of the site and also the employment site and this shows from the point from the other side of the hedge besides access you can see the general environment looking out this is going towards best of the West over here the railway line and again you can see the northern boundary of the site here with the woodland edge and this gives an idea of the character with the TW site the boundaries in how significant the boundary treatment is the nature of trees could be retained along particularly along this item these two trees here I'm looking back the other way again similar sort of treatment along the boundaries this is looking from the route the opposite side from down south again but from the railway and as you can bridge over the apart from you from the forest of embankment again some boundaries gives an idea the hives I was looking into the other corner of the side southeast corner site this is where an attenuation basin is proposed but again it shows the nature of enclosure and the nature of the existing vegetation and also the also indicated footpath network as well again a view looking north and the southern part of the site that's interesting one looking to the north again you can just see on the horizon the woodland area here which is the northern boundary and again gives an appropriate nature the thickness of that woodland boundary with woodland edge which is to be retained and again looking back towards it from west we'll see the boundary this is where one of the larger units is going and it's a backdrop of these trees here and again you can view back down to the scheme and a view back towards the site access across the from the western boundary so again it gives the scale of the site you see how large it is so in terms of the indicative master plan and I said before it's indicated as far as it's on this side this is the detailed part but you can see the main components of the scheme the parking the service areas the main access road which comes in it shows the extensive buffer areas beginning to show them along this boundary here with the tail wimpy site dwellings on this particular side here and again it shows the general spacing of buildings and sort of the infrastructure associated with them that's the attenuation pond we're just talking about there and this helps to build up a picture of the framework of the site and how much open space and green space and infrastructure which has been provided and you can see a lot of blue infrastructure on here so we've got ponds here wildlife ponds around periphery here and again over here actually what you've got a series of open spaces and public open spaces here the parks in there as well so in terms of this unemployment site of this nature it actually sets it apart from some of larger employment sites elsewhere it's quite unusual to have a set of open spaces of this particular nature which you provide through it it on these green streets you can see this can't you see it those swales but again we pick up the the bundling and the amount of a green separation between the two between the two sides which is obviously important one of the things that's important about Basfordy's is connectivity and whilst it's not quite showing particularly well on the site there are footpath links in and out of the adjacent residential areas obviously you can come up this road here and again through the tailwind scheme here this is what's known as the east west gateway which links up to south Cheshire Grove village and again it's a good terminating feature here it enters into a park in this particular area of the site and again the links spread out and again down this side as well so that's broadly the proposals in their overall nature in terms of the outlining proposals and clearly they're indicated at this stage but again there are certain things which can be set and the first thing we're looking at is the core parameters plans and again in this case it's very basic but I think this is the fundamentals to start with you must secure the perimeter landscape the route's going through the network and also this park here so that's one of the parameters plans then build on that with the maximum uses within this area shows broadly there's a quantum of development but importantly from this slide there is that commitment to office accommodation in this part of the site here which is important because it's at the main entrance to the site and also because its relationship with the residential properties to the eastern side here and again it's built on again at the plan this is the height buildings and effectively the height I think I've got this right in the blue area the maximum height is 20 meters with a eaves of around about 15 albeit that will be that is quite flexible because we haven't heard the details in this area yet so it's up to a maximum so clearly that's important for secure offices in this particular area here and ensure an appropriate relationship and again that active sense of rival when you come into the site in this area is where what all the buildings are and again you could talk about 23 meters to ridge and 18 meters to the east or into the orange help it's defined that's similar to the side these buildings on this side these are all about the same sort of size they're 20 meters and that's 23 so in terms of the way that the sites are going to be put together is the regulating plan and in addition to the parameters plan the design coding this provides some certainty in delivering a mixed employment using to establish the overall framework and including open spaces focal points focal points green spaces green corridors import them ponds and so forth within this site this is just the overall strategy particularly as it's delivering in this area of the site and will help guide the detailed design and the main features for the reserve matter submissions so just turning to the full application area so let's say we've considered the outline so you've seen the sort of details that we put forward for that but we are looking at a detailed submission as well and this relates specifically to this area of the site which is effectively the northern area and again one of the things we talked about is the need for extensive buffers and acoustic barrier between this area here and the nearest residential properties of the 2w scheme and the quite significant standoff distances between that and the new housing unit one which is this one has been repositioned so that the car park and its entrance there are significant features when you come into the site rather than having the bulk of the building where it was previously which would look like provide quite an over dominating effect at the entrance so that's a significant improvement in terms of the way this the entrance and the feel to the site when you're entering it gives you an idea of the general elevations it's kind of typical for buildings of this nature you've got contrasting areas pattern patterning cladding the pallet materials of different types of cladding they're important areas and important glazed features and focal points on the building the number of the buildings and so forth but it's very typical that's unit one as i said this building is about 20 meters high and 15 meters to its leaves just going through them quickly unit two this is the tallest building on the site this goes to 23 meters but it's in the far corner in the northwestern corner furthest up from the 2w site and again this a complete family buildings which have a similar sort of palette there's unit three which is just behind unit one these are all b8 and b2 uses cosmonaut industry and again it's useful to show typical sections of the building the reason for showing it is again to show their overall scale but also shows different elements which are proposed and it's important that in addition to the office space we're providing on the southern side of the site getting it within these sort of areas quite significant areas in the ends of the buildings upper floor office kind of the first floor here and on unit two you're getting it on two floors i think we'll move on i think all that's showing you is that it's trying to demonstrate the extensive standoff areas between buildings and the landscape mounds which have been in between just demonstrates that we are achieving significant standups between buildings and avoid that overbearing any potential overbearing impact but slightly better you can see one of the sections here and you can see them the distance into those distances between again taking two points and again this is just to show an image of the site some images selected images will be taken from the design and access statement you can see the edges of the site the unit one now push far back and see the potential of this building here and again gives a more welcoming and more open aspect when you come into the site and again to demonstrate the palette of materials this is unit one and if you selected images that we're providing see the contrast in the scenes and that's the view of the surface so in summary whilst it is the case this is this is a strategic site allocated for employment development the mix of employment is a departure from nps2 in relation to introducing v8 use and also significant production on this space however as we set out in the report the supporting employment land report demonstrates this is acceptable given the need to respond to current market demand or long term demand and also the issues depressing the long-term demand on this space this caused overall objectives from the national policy framework in making effective use of land and also recognize the requirements of all employment sectors including storage and distribution distribution uses in suitably accessible locations and this is searching this is clearly a suitable accessible location the higher officer advises that the introduction of a proposed v8 using the site is considered acceptable and the restriction set out in nps2 is unnecessary it's concluded that acts the site of its priority network and the design of internal roads is satisfactory the traffic impact on the wider network will be mitigated through signalization of the david whitley way a500 roundabout and also the contribution of 2.45 million pounds to improvements within the a500 a5 o20 corridor so overall it's considered the proposals address the site specific requirements of policy sb2 lps2 ensure a good quality place there are positive approach to green infrastructure open space and importantly pedestrian cycle connectivity which links through to the pole that's for the site and then beyond just growth village all other issues relating to the character of the area in terms of the impact on view of important viewpoints drainage flood risk trees air quality contaminated and are addressed throughout the report i should draw members attention to an update that was prepared we have now received the environmental health officer's comments who concurs with the findings of the updated acoustic information and particularly the mitigation measures are acceptable are set out subjects and conditions being imposed making sure those mitigation measures are proposed and we also need a construction environmental management plan throughout the development to mitigate any impact on future residents so the scheme is considered to be broadly in accordance with the development plan policies economically socially and environmentally sustainable and therefore recommended for approval as concluded in the report is subject to a section one of six agreement requiring a financial contribution of 2.45 million towards highway improvement schemes and accordingly to secure off-site habitat creation secure biodiversity net gain and also the series of conditions for both the outline of all elements of proposals at the end of the report thank you richard uh well now i'm going to call councilor steve edgar to um speak and then councilor edgar when he's finished speaking uh and if there are no questions he will then leave the room and return for the next item uh councilor braithwaite just advising you in advance that you are the nearest councilor apart from councilor edgar i'm so sorry councilor braviton i already came yeah you are you are the nearest councilor apart from councilor edgar so when it comes to the debate i will be coming to you first councilor edgar you have two and a half minutes because you're sharing your time with councilor and then there may be questions thank you chair i'm asking that this application be deferred to look for a better design solution i'm sorry but these huge great sheds in a field is simply not good enough for crew i recognize and support the need for jobs but this needs to be an exemplar build something that crew can be proud of please listen to john cornell at the parry council a retired planning officer he will give more detail into the reasons for any of them are there any questions to councilor edgar in that case councilor edgar if you could leave the room and i'll ask councilor hela please to come to the microphone good morning council head before you start and councilor edgar clearly wouldn't choose the five minutes allocated so i would allow you to speak for up to four minutes i won't be speaking for that long okay thank you you may be moving the thing along there may be questions okay i'm again here today to ask that this application be deferred and the best better designs for these buildings are investigated these gray sheds in a field will be a blot on the landscape and there must be better designs out there that can be looked into i don't feel crew should accept this poor design quality and we definitely deserve better are there any questions to councilor hela in that case council hela thank you very much i will now call town parish counselor cornell to the microphone council cornell council cornell you have five minutes and if you there may be questions afterwards thank you chair now the parish council's concerns are fully documented in your officer's report we stand by those comments it's acknowledged we acknowledge this application relates to a significant part of basford east and creates the opportunity for a high quality employment led development basford east has always been showcased as an exemplar development at the gateway to crew and the northwest in the parish council's view the current proposal falls short of that threshold we welcome the economic benefits but given the proximity of the proposed non-employment uses which all need to interact together we consider this proposal as currently presented to be an over intensive development basically now the following points of particular concern height of buildings we disagree that this is considered acceptable whilst we note the comment that high restrictions could be covered at reserve matter stage we want to see a high restriction imposed on the three large buildings the subject of the full application in addition to the outline the large units on basford west are joining jack mills way and shovington bypass are limited to a maximum of 18 meters across the site with a height of 15 meters in the fringe locations such restrictions in our view would help ensure that the units sit in and not on the landscape design of the units we acknowledge that this is subjective but consider these very large units will appear drab stark and characterless they could be cited anywhere in the uk we'd expect expect better in an exemplar development landscape and structure planting this should be established and allowed to partially mature at least before any development commences can't see any reference to that made in the report access to the repositioned unit one the sole access for both delivery vehicles and car parking would appear to be at the rear of the proposed wimpy housing question why can't the delivery vehicles be made to enter an exit from the proposed access road on the western side of this unit potential amenity noise nuisance issues here pedestrian crossing of david whitby way our parish council takes the view that two toucan crossings will be totally inadequate to ensure a safe facility for pedestrians crossing david whitby way that's close to the central roundabout this road is currently a 50 mile an hour speed limit and we'd like to see reference in the report to a contribution of 106 monies to creating something safer for example a bridge pedestrian bridge this roundabout it's important to note this roundabout will be the only entry and exit point for about 800 dwellings on either side of the road a two-form entry primary school and community facilities including shops that's all in addition to the current proposal network rail with knowledge that this is a separate application but given that network rail are providing an essential part of the highway infrastructure to allow the current proposal to happen we consider the two applications to be inextricably linked we're concerned as to the impact of the potential very heavy traffic that's bogies on articulated lorries etc will have all entering and exiting of this central roundabout your officer's report refers only to a comparatively small number of daily trips we understand that wimpy will be commencing their housing at the northern end of the site that's closest to the three units the subject of the full application shouldn't question shouldn't there be a specific condition limited delay limiting noise light pollution and hours of operation during construction should the houses be built and occupied first and finally liaison group we've requested this in the report but there's no reference to it parish council chair urges the board to give serious consideration to its concerns thank you thank you very much council Cornell if you can stay there to start with are there any questions to council Cornell councilor marshall and then council rabbiton thank you chair you explained very well that um the um you welcome it as an employment opportunity but he used a phrase that said the part of it is non-employment can you explain what you meant by that yes i can bus for the east there's all kinds of uses on there and this abuts a detailed permission although it's not yet built for wimpy houses homes and that's about 300 dwellings on the opposite side of david whitby way right on this central roundabout is a proposed two form entry primary school on this side on the side of dick way david whitby way where this application is there's going to be community facilities that shops and i think there's a police facility going on there and on the far side of david whitby way there's a detailed plan information for about in the region of about 470 dwellings so that's what i mean by the other non-employment uses bass bass for the east strategic development area which we accept but it's got all these component parts and these component parts the thing has got to work in in a nutshell and and this is where i put it we put a question mark on the intensity of this development council batherton thank you council cornell and you mentioned about the height of the buildings which i totally agree with because these things are getting bigger and bigger with every application you mentioned that they look bland and you know boring basically as they are have you any ideas i mean obviously these are only um outline drawings they're not what's going to be they're what they're going to look like are you of an opinion that there should be some sort of color design or color scheme or would you be happy to see a color scheme um mentioned to the developer we did have a similar thing at southern planning recently where they uh they presented something like this and we've got them to rethink the color scheme um would you think of green or something like that would blend into the background better as i as i've said this is subjective and i'm certainly not a design planner however i have seen developers in the country subtle shade of green um which something to sit down into the landscape i think we've got to think out of the box a little bit here even looking at the development of radway green whatever you think of those this is on the edge of the royal ordnance factory going into walsage there's a banding on the top of it and i came the other day in the train and i thought well this doesn't look bad it it sort of gave a feel of quality about the development so i i it's a complex area this but i i do think serious consideration should be given um there's ways of doing it i i and i keep i keep using this word exemplar development you know entry to the northwest and to crew and you want to be able to say well what we were cheating bastard east absolutely superb go and replicate it somewhere else that's what i'm trying to get over yeah and the second one was sorry i might have misheard what you said you were talking about the landscaping on the site and you were inferring that the landscaping should be done and become established before the building starts yes it's not the right way around to do these things because big lorries can take down small well what i'm talking about here and basically structure planting i realize you you don't do all the fine landscaping until buildings are up but there's mounding here as part of structure planting to ease the impact from that wimpy development because that wimpy development it it's an excellent development i think with an open space through the middle and anything that can be done to reduce the impact of this when they start to put the buildings up and there's a lot of mounding to go in so that's the kind of thing i'm talking about any more councilor council harrison thank you counselor um with your local knowledge is there any other potential access needless roots that we could obviously look at i think i think that is a difficult one uh i've even mentioned in the past but it's been thrown out why couldn't we get access into some of this off the shelvington bypass uh that that that really would ease things considerably because you know it it's the additional traffic that's coming through the wimpy development onto the back of this site i recognize a huge site it's nearly 100 acres but you know having said that if you could say we've raised it in the past mind you this was when hs2 was alive hs2 is to one side now and they were messing about with the shelvington bypass as part of that scheme whether one could get access from the side there in theory that would be good how practical it is it needs to be looked at thank you are there any other questions in that case thank you very much uh counselor canal i'm now going to ask mr harvey who is the applicant's agent to come to the microphone please mr harvey you have three minutes after which there may be questions thank you chair um newspapers are a national developer with a long track record of pacemaking and delivering jobs to fit the needs and demands of local areas for the benefit of the local communities the scheme before yesterday has been developed for extensive engagement with the treasury's council dating back to 2021 from the outset news have been committed to providing a high quality employment enrollment at basford east which will create significant economic benefits and what's also being deliverable in the immediate term the site is allocated for employment used by the local plan whilst behavior statistics was not originally proposed when the local plan was adopted this was due to high waste constraints presence at that time importantly those constraints have since been removed through construction of the new link over to the a5 a500 the current proposed mix of uses is therefore broader comprising behavior logistics beta industrial space supported by a still significant quantum of offices the planning authority has confirmed the proposed mix of uses is acceptable the scheme designers of all the other recent ones a number of concessions have been made including revising the site layout to move and reorientate certain units notably the proposals are supported by the council's design and landscape offices visual impacts have been minimized and the scheme will deliver vast areas of green infrastructure including two pocket parks connected by a green corridor nature paths and walking trails that can be used by all news are proposing a high quality scheme that will deliver important economic benefits these include creation of up to two well creation of 2900 full-time jobs once operational up to 580 full-time jobs off-site 165 construction jobs a year for the duration of the 10-year construction period 3.4 million grand business rate revenue each year for cheddar east attracting further investment of labor into the into the community and providing a significant employment boost to the local area the proposed development also be highly sustainable targeting very very good accreditation including measures such as pv solar pv panels sustainable urban drainage systems and significant habitat creation among others with the aim of making this an exemplar employment development for the northwest this is a high quality scheme that will deliver important regeneration benefits and jobs to cheddar east the application is recommended for approval by officers it is clear from the committee report that the scheme is acceptable in planning terms there are no objections from consultees and no technical reasons why planning permission should not be granted on this basis with respect to request the application approved thank you mr harvey and well done that was well within your time i was about to tell you you've got 15 minutes 15 seconds left so are there any questions to mr harvey so councilor smethin councilor harrison thank you chair i'm wondering how do you expect the buildings and their materials that they're covered with how does that lend you to the area and how will they work out yeah so in terms of the materials they've obviously been selected so they are appropriate to the area this is a strategic scale employment development and we're well aware that they are significant buildings in terms of scale and massing but the the architect on this scheme believes that the the elevational treatment um introducing interest as well to the elevations which are significantly length has been achieved um in terms of the materials and how will they weather uh this is an important consideration for all developments which will obviously be in place for a significant number of years and they've been selected so they are durable and appropriate for you know varying weather conditions um but also that they can be maintained over the long term um by way of cleaning and so on and so forth so um yeah in our view um and based on the architects extensive experience in providing the logistics and employment developments across the country um we think the elevational treatment scheme design and material selection is appropriate do you want to come back councilor smith no i don't know a great deal about buildings and how they're going particularly apart from residential properties okay okay councilor harrison uh just two questions the first one is the projected height of the bungen and the eastern side and then also and same question i asked the uh local councilor and have you looked at any other access and egress routes to the west and then obviously going by the north to alleviate the lgb from hdbs coming to the residential area okay um i mean just in terms of the bunding um i can't remember the exact height i haven't got a note on that in front of me but it's quite significant in scale um we did submit sections which the officers rightly pointed to in his introduction um showing the relationship between the employment uses and the neighboring residential development um further to the uh the height of the bunding which is well above head height um the uh separation distances between the buildings and the residential development is also very significant i think at a minimum it's of 50 54 meters i believe um increasing up to 114 meters in relation to unit one three so um yeah obviously very significant in terms of scale of those separation distances um in terms of the access points um i mean given the location of the site um and also the other developments which have come forward as part of this strategic allocation um we think this is the appropriate access solution for the employment development and there aren't any other obvious or clear access points which we could use for this development which would have a lesser impact than that which has been selected and designed into the scheme um so from our perspective and also from the council's highways team's perspective this is the appropriate solution and any impacts associated with the highways and traffic generation can be mitigated and will be mitigated as a result of the development but also the significant financial contributions which the uh the applicant is making to off-site highways works i mean looking at the road to the to the west you see i can see it goes up and obviously to the north and under the train line i just didn't know whether that has been explored as to whether obviously you can use that as access um i'm sure it's been considered when we were preparing the master plan but it's obviously been ruled out so we think that the access solution that we have got here is the right one council Harrison you might want to ask um the highways officer about that situation because i suspect the gentleman may not know the historic history behind it so i have any other questions before i ask mine i have a few questions the um previous um speaker has made reference to the height of the knee on the adjacent side of the buildings being a maximum of 18 meters in some place only 15 um can you explain i recognize you said there was not it was architecturally designed explain why your buildings are going to be um to a maximum of 25 meters in height i mean what i would say is that this is a spectrum of development at this stage um the uh scheme design the scale and massing has been designed um so it's appropriate to modern um employment users needs in terms of uh height and over recent years the scale of logistics industrial development has been increasing um that's acknowledged by developers across the country the reason being um there have been advances in uh technology and the way that these buildings actually work operationally um so the footprint of a building um doesn't have to be as big as it used to be um but the the equipment inside particularly in terms of logistics development um there are different machines now which can basically access um the upper levels of buildings um so what you are obviously seeing is an increasing height but given ways to that is a reduction in floor space for the same amount of employment development effectively on the site so it has been designed to meet the needs of modern day employment so it the likes of amazon who have lots of mechanical logistics insights and i would say there is a variation in height as well across the units that are proposed on the site um so there is correctability ultimately going forward for different occupiers to ultimately move into the site i mean the aim of this development is to bring jobs to the cheshire east the best way to do that is to make it as attractive as possible for as many occupiers and employment generators as possible we believe that we're doing that with this design solution okay um if we turn we're talking about design materials obviously being some mention of them would you be amenable to reviewing the external materials um again to perhaps take on board um some of the concerns that are being raised by the local members and the parish council i believe we will have a planning audition attached to the commission which requires um materials to be approved in detail going forward um so there is some flexibility there in any case um when it comes to material choice introduction um i'd reiterate that we've not now firstly um only part of the government is by far in detail the rest is in our line and we've had extensive engagement discussions with the council design and landscape officers to come to the solution that we have got um we've already redesigned the scheme to an extent and we've done a lot of work coming up with a design code regulating plan and so on to make sure that the scheme design materials choice and visual impacts of the scheme are ultimately acceptable and in agreement with council officers so there is some flexibility to that condition discharge stage in any case but certainly as part of the outline scheme that's something that will need to be agreed with officers going forward so so maybe it's something that the ward members and and and others concerned about the coloration of the materials should be raising with a design officer perhaps yes i accepted it now finally one one point uh it was raised as an issue about why you were bringing the lorries in at the immediate entrance in front of all the cars in the item that the unit in unit one and it would seem perfectly feasible for um heavy good vehicles to be able to brought in from uh the internal height road that's being created between units uh one three and two i just wondered why you're doing that but i can see and i'm afraid the plan is so small i can't read it there appears to be a large um area that looks potentially like a washing or weighing area for lorries at the top end just off of where the opposite where the car parking is yeah so what's the question right so so the issue is why are you taking the lorries in that way rather than coming in off of the the internal uh the internal road to the south where it is on my plan it's probably to the east because it's obviously on its side um because it that because heavy goods vehicles are by their very nature uh greater noise um providers and you are that's nearest to the housing that was a question that was raised and it didn't seem logical to me at first but then i've seen what appears to be either a truck washing facility or a weighing machine because i know that sometimes you have to weigh trucks when they leave and enter the site so is that what is that the reason why uh i believe that's part of it um i mean it's worth pointing out as well we've already touched on this that um the orientation of that unit has been amended at the request of the council so that the car park is to the north of the unit well further to that we have got that significant landscape buttons and an acoustic fence so from our perspective in terms of any potential noise impacts from lorries accessing to the accessing itself that has been mitigated for and will be mitigated for as part of the scheme design um so so what before it was rearranged was the access to the lorries to the south yes yeah okay thank you very much and you've given me enough information okay to think about it okay are there any other questions for alice's gentleman go back to see thank you very much in that case i will now ask thank you very much we'll go back to see now can i ask members sorry no officers first to come back to respond to any points that were raised by the public speakers okay there's quite a lot of issues there i think principally focusing on focusing on the height and the design sort of side of things i think i think that is mentioned by mr harvey that this is a strategic employment site um it is important in terms of delivering jobs within the crew and we have to balance to a certain degree the design of these units against the requirements of operators there's no issue and we've explained the reasons why that we can't introduce ba logistics use in particular onto this site and you can see the types of buildings that we're looking at it's very difficult to come up with an alternative way of cladding or elevation treatment other than these particular types of buildings and the way that they've been proposed to be elevated in this particular case they have i think it's fair to say there are focal points that they're providing there are glazed areas for entrances at significant viewpoints within the site and again the height of the buildings again are just a consequence of today's operating requirements i think i would like to emphasize though that i think the main issues raised by particular council Cornell with regard to i think viewpoints on and on and within to within the site or into the site there is significant green infrastructure being provided between unit one unit three and the residential development to the east taylor wimpy comprising a number of components including a bund which is three to five meters high including acoustic fencing and landscape and treatment building on that very significant mature tree cover and hedgerow cover which is already there so to a certain extent the heights of the buildings can be as mr cornell said in turn can be absorbed into landscape because of the nature of what we've got already and building on that and including very significant separating distances between the nearest units and the tail wimpy scheme and they do extend it is correct to say that between unit one which is on there it's 114 meters from the north interface to achieve unit three at the back slightly less around about 60 meters at its nearest point to the nearest dwelling so there's quite significant separation and interface so there's i say the two issues going on here given the heights of the buildings there's been a full survey of viewpoints from within and around the site through the through an lbia they've come up with no significant harm to anything beyond particularly the viewpoints they did additional viewpoints with western they've done additional viewpoints looking into the site they've looked from through hall and basically the worst sort of impact you're getting is seeing that the heights of the roof from west the very worst impact is the very very top of the roof beyond existing tree cover so in terms of the landscape there's no substantive impact from the heights of these particularly large buildings the largest building actually is in the core northwestern corner of the site which is which is the one in the left hand corner which is adjacent to the rails depot and also the woodland fringe so essentially it's against the backdrop of existing trees and existing buildings so in terms of the landscape it's a very difficult call to make to say that is causing substantive or significant harm in terms of amenity you can take the same view in terms of which of things what we're talking about from the table of this scheme in terms of those non-employment uses from the best least application again as i said that existing extensive bunding separation will mitigate that particular harm so i think the question was raised about when will this substantive band staying put in well it's part of the environmental health officer's view the consultation we received is that certainly the bunding along the eastern boundary should be put in prior to the commencement construction of the first unit within that site so it's actually critical to get that up and going and get that landscaping feature in and to ensure that that mitigation is is provided in terms of pladding color yes that is a thorny issue and we've had many many discussions about these large buildings although although excuse southern area in these logistics development this is quite a neutral palette i think it's understating it slightly but again it has it it does have the potential to enliven the some of the faith you know through through the condition discharge process and through maybe a careful selection of material to provide some visual interest and so forth but as we said in the report itself there is that danger if you try to be too artistic about it you end up with these pladding solutions all these color solutions actually actually emphasize the scale of this building even more the massing gets even worse so it's it's the law of unintended consequences to to a certain extent so effectively what we've got is quite a neutral you know how you can you can you can see it as a positive in some ways that it is neutral it may others see it black as black but and but essentially these are buildings that today the design officer in the report recognizes the limitations of what we can do here and i think that on balance what we've tried to do is to say well and the approach of the applicant through the design process was to introduce substantive amounts of green infrastructure in the site extensive areas of planting extensive areas of habitat creation extent areas of pocket parks for the use of employees and residents to try and mitigate the harm divide that spacious feeling but also to try in the longer term providing some foil to these buildings as well in terms of the green space so i think in trying to mitigate those issues i think high design overall scale i think i think we we feel that the scheme does that in terms of an alternative way of how of the treatment of the spaces around them and the landscaping proposals oh yes i mean before i think i think john mr cornell raised issues about the network rail traffic it will happen from that spine road as well it might be worthwhile just addressing those the high road issues in turkey i think yeah thank you so um i mean he said it's a complicated mix-use site but it's uh it's a scheme that i've been involved with from from the very beginning um and we did look originally um at alternative access proposals to separate the employment land from the um the residential land um and this particular part of the site that's incredibly difficult so the height difference would be a 500 road um and you'd end up with a gigantic sort of massive uh sort of slick road arm uh it would almost certainly have to be a um a left-only sort of junction at that location because of the obscenity of the roundabouts um you end up with all sorts of um unusual turning movements of the existing roundabout and from a recollection from the work we did a few years ago the whole thing was just uneconomic and generally unfeasible um so what we have we have a situation where the existing dual carriage rate a 500 david whitby way that was designed for you know for the traffic that would eventually come from from the wider developments um the road that comes off the central roundabout um it's relatively spacious it's got generous surges um and we have provided as part of this allocation this permission uh so it's application a right turn lane facility so that the uh the residents from the tail over in the episode to the road development are inconvenienced unnecessarily um in terms of the traffic generation the roundabout works adequately um as it as it was planned to do i would make the point that the uh the network rail sort of depot generates a very small amount of traffic i think from just looking at the figure that's around 170 vehicles a day whole day um which is a very small proportion of the traffic on the network and that traffic is taken off western road so currently the depot is served from western road so there's 170 vehicles come off western road uh across an uncontrolled level crossing so there's a road safety benefit in closing the access as well essentially um i think those were the ones that initially i was asked to comment on but if i've forgotten anything please do put a microphone this application has been a long time in the making um to be honest we did a lot of work before it got anywhere around the employment uses because the local plan um quite rightly was set up but it's not its time around um huge amounts of office space and the world has changed somewhat and we have to recognize that which is why we spent a lot of time pushing applicants on the mix of uses um we know logistics and the big sheds are stuff that is being built they've you know probably covid has enhanced that um the modern sheds that you have today are also employers which we need to remember they do employ people and there is increasingly um offices within them as well um if you go to the reference has been made i think so basswood west to an extent which are so for example basswood west here you see the sheds there this site is not going to be dissimilar in terms of size they might be slightly higher to be honest once you get about 20 meters you don't really notice whether it's 23 24 25 and the setback from here as well the the visual bits unless you're going to be doing what richard didn't do which was to sort of stand on the bridge and take pictures you're not really going to notice the heights because of the intervening residential stuff so i think in terms of the heights in the mix um a lot of attention being done around that a lot of attention around design it is a behold stuff and yes you can probably find these shirts up and down the m6 or wherever you go you see them all the time um they're functional they're only going to be of a certain design and there are different yeah there are different mixes some you love some you hate anything like really innovative um so i think in terms of just to to sort of emphasize where we've we've come from i think the you know we've been well aware about the relationship issues with taylor wimp as well um in terms of the balance and getting the distances and the set-offs um trying to just find the parameters plan i'll just keep going so the one thing that we have done and be very clear about it is that those blue areas on there are basically are to be trained for offices even though that's part of the future application reserve matters because we do want to maintain that long term because local plans are here to cover long periods they're not just here to cover what's what's trendy now so we're recognizing what's trendy now which is logistics but we also want to make sure that we're giving ourselves the ability to flex in the future and obviously applicants have indicated this is speculative um you know it may well be best approval but it all of a sudden it won't be speculative in terms of the the the sort of the full part of the application but we never know you know that this is you know that's why we've only got part of this has been a full application because obviously there's there's an unknown sort of what what will happen around the corner um just the final bit is to pick up in terms of the um so just in terms of the um this the issue about the access into the so this was the thing the bit that was raised about can we bring in the access to unit one around so basically this is this is a residential um we've heard there's large landscaping there's bunding um there is no issue in terms of residential amenity um yes you'll probably hear something if you if you're sort of uh in an acquirement but in terms of normal standoffs and there's significant worst relationships that exist already but obviously that's this is a new development so we can make sure we're treating it right we've got existing planting there's the bunding going in but i think the point that was raised was about this is the route that both in terms of the car parking for the the employers of the site and also the larger logistics vehicles coming into the back here and i think the point was raised well why can they not come all the way down here and come in here i guess they could do but it will change the layout of how this works here wouldn't it in terms of and they've also got parked vehicles there whatever it is and etc so um i guess it could be potentially redesigned if it needed to i suppose my point is in terms of is it really needed i'll leave that with you members that's the i'm just trying to highlight the issue that's been raised that that's that's the particular issue we've got um cars if you like coming in here and it's the larger vehicles coming in and could they come in there i'm quite sure they could do um it might require a little bit of an internal rejig to that to that site um i guess that's something to i mean if they are speculative then you know again some of these things might get changed going forward anyway even though this is a full application what you find is the individual while there is a growing demand as you know just the market those are the heights of buildings to make sure you can maximize efficiency that's what it's about especially can you get your automated robot robotic stuff that goes up and down your shelving units to pick stuff up um so there we are they are built for a certain size but ultimately it's speculative and that will you know may guide and make some minor changes going forward but so that was just the point i just wanted to highlight thank you very much mr malcolm just to point out that the what i thought was a a weigh station is in fact a um substation if so it's nothing to do with this so uh the actual lorries etc um so any questions to officers so so councilor edwards council harrison and councilor gorman councilor jackson in that order please thank you thank you chair um the ecology element in the report does obviously emphasize the fact that the development of this kind of greenfield site is liable to affect the um if you like the whole ecology of the area now there are a number of um conditions and all i'd like is some assurance that the obvious damage that's noted in that ecology section to a variety of species some which are protected in terms of the conditions we have actually if you like done the best that we can as a planning authority in in order to look for compensation or i mean i know that there are 10 problems disappearing 14 problems i gather being created um i'm not an expert in this area but are we doing the best we can in relation to the damage being close that's number one and number two uh is there anything we should know about the um if you like the plans for renewable energy for the site at this stage or is that a later in question to ask thank you you're absolutely right in terms of ecology the substantive effects we have an environmental state for environmental impact state which accompanies this scheme you've probably seen it on the website it's a huge document with a huge number of surveys which to be an additional information which has been provided as you can imagine there's been quite a large number of additional service we've arrived on protected species and so forth this has been evaluated by the council psychologist in terms of the losses there are a number of ponds which have been lost but a number of the ponds aren't particularly um highly rated in terms of their ecological value some are and most of them aren't so when i was showing before in terms of landscape proposals there are effectively habitat creation areas and obviously to ensure that they're more attractive to certain protected species and great significance etc and another other species can be provided but the main impact or potential impact on that site was really with regards to asper brook and how the site trained and that's why you can see the substantive infrastructure around the site so you one of the conditions that the lot conditions one of the conditions relates to basically a number of such trains being provided which is quite a significant ask so in this in this particular site you have water passing from carp take for example access roads passing through reed beds swales to attend the patient pond and then discharged into the brook in a fairly informal and so it's quite a complicated how that's changing ecology of dovetail together to protect protected species the protected species in the brook is a quite a renowned population of white claw crayfish which again has been mentioned by the environment agency so we've gone to i think in terms of the best we can do i don't think they've had anything further we can do connecting the species on that particular site from the ecology point of view in terms of renewable energy there is a sustainable energy statement which accompanies the application which we can approve of the document and that sets out how they will make the scheme as energy sustainable as possible the usual requirements such as solar voltaic cells etc possible ground sources problems um the use of other other other things but the bream i think i don't know about rating but it's a high bream rating and again in terms of the building construction itself to be as energy sustainable as possible so that issue has been addressed in the uh in the submission thank you presumably vehicle propulsion even a larger vehicle is going to change every time and has in terms of the technologies will eventually end up in something that has that sort of like is a new future you know in that sense i wouldn't say in that particular i think like you say the industry's moving you know logistics industry moves on doesn't it i mean i think amazon what amazon's vehicles for example electric vehicles now for example that's just as an example of saying yeah this is a site for them but clearly the logistics industry like every other industry is becoming more um aware of its environmental impact and clearly you know whilst it's not necessarily planning we can insist on it through planning requirements it's necessary it's definitely coming through other other regulation and legislation council Harrison uh thank you it's not really a question it's just mainly a comment i accept obviously the rationale as to why this is the only accessible route into the site however as we work on the local plan the next local plan can we please mitigate having large heavy good vehicles going through residential sites and obviously the huge hazard that it imposes on the area and mainly towards children um i i do accept obviously in this case you know it's been done it's allocated it's industrial but when we look at site allocation can we please bear that in mind i allowed you to carry on but in fact you asked this section is for questions relating to the planning application if you want to give an answer yes i know it wasn't necessarily a question as such but i think ultimately um yes so we can and we do and i think ultimately in this site it's always been a balance that was one of the reasons why the issue about offices and that relationship issues that was put in here originally um i think it emanated from through a highway discussion as opposed to the amenity one but that's also it would have also been a dual purpose for sort of um we wanted to create mixed uses so that we're reducing sustainability reducing sorry reducing travel for sustainability reasons so providing we get the right mix and the right balance um but i think in terms of we were very much well aware that this was an employment site when the residential scheme was being constructed at taylor wimpy so while you're right it it pulls with perhaps some concerns we're aware of that so we've we've tried to mitigate that as much as possible bearing in mind the uses as they've come forward so but yeah we will always look to sort of improve and make sure those relationships are such that they can co-habit together councilor gorman then councilor jackson thanks jeff um i just wanted to improvise some of the comments that were made very eloquently by the representative from western and bassford parish council around traffic numbers um i mean this is an industrial stroke office development cheek by jaw with a residential development and then we've got a school coming in are we very i just want to know or be really reassured that we've got our research right on the traffic numbers here um and what mitigation are we are we i'd really like to know exactly what the mitigation uh is being put in on the traffic numbers and really taking into account road safety especially with children getting to and from school that's the first one second one i think has been covered by my colleague about sustainable energy production i'm glad to see briam guidelines aren't being paid attention to here um i also wanted to represent i noticed that barn owls commentaries water rolls barracks badges and reptiles are being covered but crew town council did raise particular points about um the swift and the um installation of swift boxes could that be made a note of as well as the other list of animals that are being quite lightly protected thirdly um there's a local resident has made the point about contributing to the local 85 bus service and suggesting that through s106 there might be a contribution of 50 000 pounds to improve the current hourly service that goes past uh is that being considered question and finally again from the contribution from the parish council is the possibility of a liaison group here there are lots of very genuine concerns by the local community about issues here and i think a liaison group may well be a really good way of involving the local community in some of these really quite difficult and sensitive issues so i'd like to comment on that as well thank you thank you mr taylor if you can ask the questions that relate to yours and if then um we're going to answer the other questions please yeah in terms of the last point yes i i apologize for the we hadn't come it was noted from western parish council and clearly is the case that surrounding developments do have liaison committees involved in the parish council so there's no reason why i'm picking the scale of darling to this nature it would be advantageous to have such a committee particularly as the residential uh development grows and clearly more attempt you know we want to try and avoid issues of developing uh between that liaison uh during the course of it so yes a condition can be imposed on and in both very long lists for a for a liaison group to be provided um you mentioned about swift boxes in terms of i think there is a condition um it's not obviously apparent when you see it it's an ecological strategy condition it includes barriers but we can include the to make sure every every everybody's accommodated uh for boxes uh and they've come out on sustainable energy i won't talk about that any further i'll just intrude on mr griffith's area in terms of the comment made by the residents about the 85 plus service and paul will probably correct me but i'm sure i'm right um in terms of the larger residential schemes that we've got within basque beast already they're already substantial um section 106 contributions specifically to secure bus service in that area so there's no reason why this site would not be served just as the residential scheme will be in that in their date with the corridor not without that contribution yeah that's right so um the bus service is out along western road at the moment it's commercial service as well um so that there's funding already in place uh to allow that service to be diverted into the battery sites to serve both the residential and the employment land in terms of improving the frequency of that service um that's going to take a sizable amount of funding i mean we're looking these days additional buses around 200 000 pounds a year of revenue costs um but the strategy actually and obviously to be determined for a future application is the garden village site which is immediately adjacent to this allocation negotiations are well advanced to strengthen that bus service from that application so um taking in the round what we will have is a bus service that you know will be more frequent and we'll access this site as a handing glove as part of the garden village application so that's sort of the bus service elements um in terms of the traffic it's it's always been a concern you know and we have spent an awful long time with the applicants um coming to a solution that we're happy with and we've been pretty forensic with with the assessment of the transport impacts on this so um we've secured a significant improvement from this development to the A500 Whitbyway roundabout the south a partial signalization scheme with an additional lane coming from David Whitbyway and generating sort of additional stacking capacity at that roundabout and what that will provide is betterment essentially and it's it's this is the I suppose the shop window for this application and where the majority of this application sort of direct traffic impacts are placed because a lot of this traffic is just sort of you know heading towards the strategic road network to the M6. The second element of mitigation was secured which is linked to the trigger point for the second part of the phase you know the the bit that sort of in outline only is to improve the new momos roundabout and that's a contribution to the council's most significant improvement scheme that we have partial funding for through the A500 scheme and the strategy there you know again the garden village application also impacts that roundabout and we're in discussions with those applicants to come to a strategy and what we will end up with across both applications plus the council's funding is a very significant improvement of that round because that that roundabout actually already is very congested you generally stand standing traffic there in the morning and afternoon peaks there and the final I suppose obvious thing is the other part of the road network which is the University Way roundabout to the north there's a scheme in place there all within highwayland that will be delivered by the garden village application what we sought to do is to make a contribution to the mean one most roundabout as flexible as possible such that if circumstances change or the pace of development changes with you know either of these applications we can adapt to circumstances that bring forward that application that improvement scheme in lieu of the mean one most roundabout or rather accelerate it rather than the mean one most roundabout essentially what we will have is mitigation adequate mitigation at those three key junctions and probably taking in the round and improvement because we're very aware that this is the the main route to Crewe and to Nantavich and to South Cheshire I've spoken before about Western Road the current access to the the rail servicing depot is extremely poor and anything we can do to close that is a good thing not least of course they have to sort of interfere and manually close the crew to Derby Line this is a there's a there's a manual level crossing there so I think that's sort of a hidden benefit of this in a way it's a very small number of vehicles but accessing accessing their site in a much more suitable manner the final thing I think you raised was around I suppose the impact of larger vehicles and school children access to education facilities so Spy Road that's been constructed has a cycleway and that's been extended for the for the road that will continue to this site so there are cycling facilities and where those facilities during David will be away there's a very good cycle facility on there as well and with the two applications Richard has spoken about are providing two concrossing facilities of David will be right and either side of the roundabout and as part of those as part of those designs that have been implemented there will be a review of the speed limit naturally because they're being delivered through section 278 agreements which means the development sort of has to do everything and we'll be looking to see whether it's appropriate to drop the speed limit down to 40 I recognize the comments from the parish council around you know we prefer sort of facilities that don't have they'll cross a grid there or practically speaking there isn't the land and the cost of that would be probably prohibitive there's anti-social aspects around you know in Chester where I live they've actually made a decision to close on the patters because of the anti-social measures some of those facilities and a bridge crossing for obvious reasons would involve for able-bodied folks a very very long diversion we have to put bridge ramps in at five percent now to comply with DDA regulations and what you would what you'd end up with is the vast majority of people would be unwilling to go with that and just cross anyway so accepting everything the parish council has said in the round I think the only viable and sort of credible solution about the two concrossing facilities and if you want to slow traffic down and provide road safety they probably do a little bit of that as well they won't really impact the travel times because there's already a little bit of congestion in the university way so I said we spent an awful lot of time looking at this and we're pretty satisfied from a Harrison transport point of view have you been satisfied with your responses Councillor Gorman yes thank you that was great thank you okay Councillor Jackson again um condition 12 13 it says submission of the scheme for protection of trees prior to commencement of the development well I'd like to see hedges as well where I know you're putting a big bun up with hedging around it and what have you those hedges can disappear with a slight of a bulldozer or whatever so I think hedges should be protected as well because they are very important brown there so if you put that in please thank you yeah Taylor yeah you're right it's it's something that it's it's basically a long yeah you've seen all the stuff down Taylor wimpy side and again it's a mixture of trees and hedges so if you protect the trees you will protect the hedges yes the hedges do protect them as well as the trees but if you'll say oh he doesn't say that would be expected thank you mr taylor if you have any schemes that come to this committee in future you can be assured that if you haven't said that you're going to protect the hedgerows that are being retained Councillor Jackson will ask you about it thank you chair so um are there any other ques I've got a couple so any any other questions in that case uh two one question actually and it relates to the um shift between uh the initial propositions for this site when it was going to allocating in the local plan and what we have before us and that relates the fact that if we are reduced we've obviously seen that we are not going to have a high volume of office uses just as a high and we're going to but which would have brought cars to the site and instead we're having lots of hgvs um so therefore are we satisfied that the change in the traffic that will be generated from the development proposed will have no greater negative impact upon the residential schemes that would have been afforded by um the the cars you access in this site for the offices and secondly I can see nowhere on here that there is some hours of operation so are we therefore assuming it's a 24-hour operation and if such are there ways in which we can at least manage the timings of um the hgvs visiting the site so they're not coming in at two o'clock in the morning yeah this is this has been quite difficult because clearly the different character of traffic between cars and hgvs and we're not going to pretend that this isn't going to generate a lot of hgv traffic because the nature of logistics uses having said that you'll notice in the dimension it in the presentation that when you look at the tailwind of your spine or how it doesn't change the tailwind of his mind they are set back so they're doing more than you normally expect sometimes around 15 to 17 meters and we're also getting planting and so forth so again the relationship probably shouldn't be that much greater between an office use versus a logistics use for example in terms of the relationship of the houses themselves and the occupants within those houses hunting that road that has been an issue however the additional acoustic information which is being provided demonstrates that with a reasonably modest improvement in double glazing trickle vents strategically cited screen fencing some of the problems that that will be sufficient in mitigating the additional or the change in traffic or noise impact that this scheme will be providing so broadly speaking we can or it will be mitigated it can be mitigated in that certainly so in terms of the volume of traffic in terms of the character of traffic on the tailwind side and our view that an environmental health officer's view then can be satisfactory the environmental health i have we've received a consultation response just an environmental health officer as part of the condition they're wanting to know some details about our operation now some units you know logistics units of the scale we're talking about will need to operate it's inevitable to operate on a 24 hour basis so it's just a case of trying to work out what those movements would be but it's reasonable to ask the question what are the hours of operation what impacts would that have it's probably unlikely that all the units will not operate on a 24 hour basis some of the units for industrial purposes there's flexible use there raucous uses as well so it's going to be just a case just trying to work out which units operate at 24 hours and what the impact that would probably be okay thank you are there any other questions in that case i'm going to move to the debate councillor braverton nothing more to say actually i think everything has been covered in such depth but really i think we should just uh i'm perfectly happy with all the answers i've had and i will simply move the approval thank you very much are there any other comments councillor moss uh just to echo uh tory's comments i'm satisfied with everything that we've said by officers and such great responses from richard taylor today um so i'm happy to second that could i ask would you be amenable to an amendment and that is that um subject to consultation with the environmental health officer and the information that's being fed that we put a condition on relating to um the hours of operation so we do not have um vehicular movements between the hours of um midnight and 6 a.m which i think is reasonable even for logistics organizations yeah okay and and secondly that the uh condition relating to uh the final version of the materials is in conjunction with award members consultation with award members and the liaison sorry with the liaison group yeah if you if the officers feel that that is a necessary thing i i just feel that given that we've been asked to defer the item i don't think that i think that's too far but given they've clearly got strong views about the materials that may be that when that when the details come in they are consulted that's all i'm asking consulted yeah consulted that the the the the the award members are consulting with materials when they're submitted yeah yeah i agree with that but i think it needs to be kept um within not not an eyesore created unnecessarily you know not sticking with what it looks like today or everything's green let's go green because everything won't be green in five years time i i i understand but at least that way they're they're being asked for their views i'm not saying that they can veto things no mr malcolm so just coming back to that last point first obviously we've been so one of the conditions will be to add the liaison group um as john connell knows um it's our mission not to put that on um but in terms of again just managing and i think it's the point that you've both talked on is what you see in terms of the color scheme is broadly agreed there's you know something around what the materials are but i'm i'm sure we can we can share a piece of metal cladding with um parish council saying look this is what it is but actually it won't mean that much i suppose i'm just trying to manage the expectation of what it's not going to be is what we want green or we want blue or we want purple spots on it the the design is being worked on accordingly so i think in terms of just need to be mindful of that expectation notwithstanding the liaison group happy to say look this is what's progressing and going forward so that's just my only caveat slightly on that um just come back on that second hours of working um effectively that will be part of the noise mitigation strategies to be submitted i'm not sure on a 24-hour logistics operation we can restrict there'll be no vehicle moves between midnight and 6am even on a local i mean i noticed from even on my local state there's deliveries that happen way before six o'clock on local convenience stores and things like that the the reassurance i think i can give members is that that's so this is a condition that environmental protection have come back with in terms of say the way they would look at it it says well what's the mitigation that's in place if vehicles are going to be coming and going at those early hours is that acceptable in terms of their normal statutory noise issues that they deal with so if it's going to be a noise generating activity they would say well that's not going to be acceptable that's what the noise mitigation strategy and we've got a condition okay got it on there already we'll put one on so again it's just about managing that a little bit in terms of i understand the points being made and clearly we want to make sure that there's a an appropriate balance it also depends upon the unit as well because unit the big one in the bottom corner is so far away other than vehicles using that public highway which we can't restrict anyway there will be no impact it's only the sort of one that's closer to us i suppose much it's that one potentially that um so again i'm just i'm just putting it out there for for discussion to to to note i i i i i i i'm happy to be guided but i think the the the the issue is that two things firstly i do recall a previous meeting uh of this board i think it was in its previous over a year ago when we had a scheme that prevented people being able to use those awful reversing things because they they particularly are quite a piercing noise and if you're asleep they will wake you up and and also obviously if we are talking about unit one with all those cars in the front the um if that's a 24-hour operation it works shift you could have people people arriving and leaving it's quite difficult so i i i will leave it to you if it's if there's a noise strategy i think that perhaps when that's designed it's just that there are ways and means of dealing with um unableness by the occupiers because you do find however well the bigger companies might be engaging we have no control over who these buildings are leased to and we might find that we just just just like with i'm not saying any of them are road road trades but they might be slightly slightly less communitarian the way they operate yeah i think i think on reflection from the discussions that the officers have just suggested you have to bear in mind that this is a 24 7 operation the people will be arriving if they're doing three shifts it's six two two ten and then through the night isn't it um inside the building one presumes is quiet is is you know a relatively sound proof box that you're going into if it comes down to just the fact of the the lorries which are not the noisy things they used to be when i was growing up the the the karmid engines or whatever they are called it's going to be the people actually coming and going and slamming their own car doors but with respect i think the people are far enough away you know if your neighbor comes home from a party later tonight slams the door you have no control over that but we're going to say i'm going to control you know what time people can go to work and so on and so on i think con reflection i think we have to leave that for the detail the working plan um yeah so i don't know that i wouldn't necessarily accept that in an amendment before we go to the vote mr malcolm is coming back with something which might resolve the problem it's just to give you the insurance about the sort of thing that we're looking at so this is from this is a recommendation for conditions from environmental protection which is basically and this is about so the mitigated mitigation recommended in the environmental statement shall be implemented in full prior to commencement the industrial process the agreed mitigation scheme shall be maintained for purposes throughout useful and once the intended occupants of the units are known and then they reference the british standard this is a british standard for rating methods of industrial and commercial sound effectively so they'll do that assessment once the individual operator is known and then the hours of the operation the units will be provided in order to be approved and conditioned by the environmental section so those individual factors basically make it quite bespoke to the actual operator and you will know through the planning process we actually can't control operators which is why we have lots of conditions but obviously environmental protection through their own statutory legislation can control operators so what what that's doing is we're putting the condition on through planning that will enable them to control the operations so that's so it's a it's a collaborative agreement effectively where we're working with colleagues to make sure that ultimately that noise level is not over sufficient to cause normal disturbance so that's that's how we're going to be progressing with that that just helps if folks move in secondary assurance on on that so i i'm withdrawing my request for that that to be there so you don't need to amend it what do we what do we say what are we doing with it with with the materials are we going to consult the ward members just out of courtesy so i'm happy we'll set up the liaison group as part of that we can also advise of the materials that we've sort of you know finally agreed etc so i think that's why it's just again attempting expectations of um changing colors no i'm not suggesting they should be able to teach inside the car otherwise you will have purple spots we haven't seen them yet either no i heard that and i was about to say be careful what you wish for um so we um basically we've got moved and seconded as of the officer's report plus any additional conditions that were required by environmental health and that the liaison group when set up will be consulted with with regard to materials and that includes the ward members all those in favor one two three four five six seven eight nine those against one do you want that recorded council Harrison okay one second do that again please all those in favor hands up high one two three four five six seven eight nine council egg is missing yes but there should be 10 people still yes so there are nine of us nine yeah and then plus one council Harrison thank you thank you okay right would anybody like a five minute break or should we go straight into the next one yeah go on then oh yes we can't start anyway because we've got to change offices so five minutes returning 25 please hold your meeting has been temporarily adjourned please hold your meeting has been temporarily adjourned you please hold your meeting has been temporarily adjourned please hold your meeting has been temporarily adjourned you please hold your meeting has been temporarily adjourned please hold your meeting has been temporarily adjourned you please hold your meeting has been temporarily adjourned please hold your meeting has been temporarily adjourned you please hold your meeting has been temporarily adjourned please hold your meeting has been temporarily adjourned you please hold your meeting has been temporarily adjourned please hold your meeting has been temporarily adjourned you please hold your meeting has been temporarily adjourned please hold your meeting has been temporarily adjourned you please hold your meeting has been temporarily adjourned please hold your meeting has been temporarily adjourned you please hold your meeting has been temporarily adjourned please hold your meeting has been temporarily adjourned you please hold your meeting has been temporarily adjourned please hold your meeting has been temporarily adjourned you please hold your meeting has been temporarily adjourned please hold your meeting has been temporarily adjourned you please hold your meeting has been temporarily adjourned please hold your meeting has been temporarily adjourned you please hold your meeting has been temporarily adjourned please hold your meeting has been temporarily adjourned you please hold your meeting has been temporarily adjourned please hold your meeting has been temporarily adjourned you please hold your meeting has been temporarily adjourned please hold your meeting has been temporarily adjourned you please hold your meeting has been temporarily adjourned please hold your meeting has been temporarily adjourned you please hold your meeting has been temporarily adjourned please hold your meeting has been temporarily adjourned you please hold your meeting has been temporarily adjourned please hold your meeting has been temporarily adjourned you please hold your meeting has been temporarily adjourned please hold your meeting has been temporarily adjourned please hold your meeting has been temporarily adjourned ladies and gentlemen we are now going to resume to application item number seven which is application two three i believe two four one nine m adlington business park london road aslinton i'm sure it should say the erection of 11 number units with access and servicing arrangements car parking landscaping and associated works brackets use classes e bracket g bracket 3 b2 and b8 closed brackets this application can be found on pages 127 to 162 of your agenda pack nick holland will now introduce his item thank you joe okay in terms of where we are it's highlighted on this plant with a star shape towards the middle bottom of your screen there um and so we're about 1.4 kilometers north of badlington 1.9 kilometers south pointing to town center immediately north of a roundabout um with the points from relief road to the left hand side and london mode to the right hand side of the site in semi-circular shape demonstrated by the red edge on this plant here in terms of what's around it we've got an existing industrial state to the immediate north um we've got adlington golf club across the point of relief road to the southwest and we've got a travel lodge and a starbucks to the southeast and the residential property to the southeast as well so the proposed site plan um 11 warehouse star units are proposed on this site and the site's allocated for employment development in the local plant in total 15,121 square meters of floor space is proposed access will be taken from london mode as i'm highlighting on your screen now that access already exists because the site prior to its proposed potential next use was used in the site compound for this point of relief road that was already formed and this is what the units will look like um this is one of the units on the frontage 11.8 meters in height gray cladding but we've incorporated some green coloring as well during the application process because on the site frontage we've got some feature glazing and some feature timber as well on some of the corners and it's the same with the other units on the frontage units two to four and the units at the back a long strip of the units and set set back from the street scene and they'll slightly step up as the site goes from east to west in terms of floor plans units relatively open by design um other than like a reception area and a wc at ground floor level and each will have a very small mezzanine level at first floor let's demonstrate through these pictures here here's a cgi image of what the development might look like in the event of approval once it's fully built out and you can see here this landscaping approach posted on the periphery that's been a big part of the discussions during the application process to get that beefed up photographs of the site so this is me approaching the site friedlington and the sites behind the poster rail fence to the top left and the road up to point is to the top right and the new point relief roads off to the left that's looking down the new point relief road with the sides of the back of the poster rail fence and that's traveling up to point and looking back down towards the roundabout with the site to the right and again a bit further side to the right and that's looking all the way across the site from london road with the point relief road in the distance you can see all the way through the site and there's a band of trees on the very back of the site at the right hand side there's a site looking from the point of relief road so that's the end there was just a quick update for members the applicant very honestly was in touch to say the contribution proposed towards the point of relief road that was in the committee report was actually too low and we miscalculated it slightly so the contribution which is in your pack of 400 odd thousand should actually read four hundred and fifty three thousand six hundred and forty two pounds for an additional five hundred and twenty two pounds so yeah the recommendation is as per the committee report and that's the end of the presentation thank you so we'll now move on to public speakers and there's only one speaker on this item and that's the agent applicant beverley musters i can ask miss moss to come to the um microphone you have five sorry three minutes um and um there may be questions afterwards thank you chair well i have written good morning but it's now saying good afternoon good afternoon council sir my chair said my name is debbie moss of horegon planning and i'm the applicant's agent your officers have provided a very detailed and pleasingly positive report we work really closely with officers especially in planning and landscape amending the proposals to bring before you a scheme which will deliver high quality employment at the strategically allocated site of business at adlington business park following the completion of the point in business at the point in relief road the connectivity in the area has improved my clients snapped up the opportunity to deliver employment development at this particular site they are an experienced developer that specialise employment development and they have an established track record of actually delivering schemes this is the third site chan sude who is part of the joint venture aquacaine has sought to deliver in cheshire cheshire east having completely um having successfully completed recent schemes at pommelton business park and park gate industrial park in nutsford you can therefore rest assured that if you approve the scheme today employment development and all the benefits that come with it will be delivered here i just wanted to touch on some of the key elements of the scheme and the external appearance was revised to incorporate colour and texture with elements of glazing so the scheme would look attractive at this gateway point next to the public highway and the existing trees along the north of the site provide low commuting and foraging value for the vats the proposed lighting in this part of the site has been reduced to a minimum whilst meeting the necessary health and safety looks levels required for the emergency footpaths around the buildings and in the yard areas the light spill will be controlled through angling the light correctly and through the use of time locks which will be set to switch off when the development is not in operation in terms of sustainability this game will deliver 22 ev charging points it proposes the use of air source heat pumps and pv panels there's parking for up to 50 bikes and two non-standard bikes there's an outside seating area for people there's grass roots on the buildings and grass on top of the bus shelter the cycle shelters that will also provide insect hotels and the scheme provides more than 20 percent bng as your officers have set out in the report there's significant areas of soft landscaping forming an integral part of this scheme with the new buildings being set back from the highway and set behind a strong buffer comprising of significant number of new trees there's two foot high whips areas of wildflower and grass plus over 640 meters of native hedgerow and other attractive native shrubs and planting no existing trees need to be removed for this scheme the proposals also include a financial contribution to the boyton point and bow pass and a pedestrian refuge just north of the access on london road just got a summary um this scheme will deliver significant benefits to the borough employment development will be delivered if the mission is granted accordingly counselors at counselors i'd respectfully ask you to endorse your officer's recommendation and approve this important employment development thank you are there any questions for miss moss not council i'm very happy that you've introduced this timber clubbing are there any other questions i have one um i'm looking at the plan and i can't see uh where you're going to store where waste is going to be stored for each of the units it will be stored internally um and then dealt with it by each of the operator um like the previous scheme before you this is speculative at the moment so we haven't got a specific way of strategy in place um but waste will be dealt with internally um by each of the operators okay thank you very much no other questions then thank you very much so we'll now go back to officers already and have any of that mr how is this anything you need to respond to are there any questions to officers well yeah councilor jackson uh tree protection implementation can i have tree and hedge protection please um you can do it just don't think there was any mr holland just so you're aware if you ever present any items to this yeah yes yeah you understand uh councilor harrison uh just a quick one on the highways the report says that the highways are happy um i've utilized well i use the junction across the road quite a lot i find it quite difficult to get out are you happy with that um i take it you'll be setting the report you are but it's a 40 and people are coming off the new uh dual carriageway or the new bypass at quite the speed i don't know whether reviewing the speed might be a potential to mitigate any risk on that junction yeah um that's a slightly different issue that's linked to mitigation measures for point and relief road so we're just finishing the sort of uh after the road's been open 12 months or soon 12 months um actually more than 12 months now and um we're doing the review of that and there's a mitigation measures budget to review the the lane and surrounding areas street lane is identified and specifically identified as one of those areas so that's sort of on our radar as pertains this application we've got a right turn lane um the traffic numbers in and out are really low so we're quite happy it's not going to make things you know um disproportionately unsafe any others i've won so is it possible to add a condition relating to the um outside storage and uh disposal of waste please um because as the application has said the waste will be stored inside and i uh don't think it will be taking many weeks before uh we have uh waste out being the bin we all do it we don't all bring our bins in uh uh in in the hour in the 12 hour slot that we're supposed to because occasionally we forget because it's raining so i it will become very easy for this to become an untidy site it's in a very um exposed position and i would hope that we would have uh to encourage uh all our occupiers to keep their waste managed and not to have loads of stuff piled up outside on a regular basis yes that can be included okay thank you very much we will now go to the debate and oh councilor jackson is the nearest yes and when i looked at it and i'm quite happy with it with all the conditions and everything um so i i move approval second counselor was his second yet any other body anybody else wish to speak on this item uh no in that case i'm just that the parish council are happy with it they have no neighbor issues no complaints from any property so council jackson you might be pleased to know that at the briefing i asked them to confirm that they had actually notified people in pointon because there was no there was limited representation and nobody wanted to speak on the item and given the recent attendance from people from pointing on another issue and i found that somewhat surprising so uh it's been proposed it's been seconded all those in favor of this scheme being approved one two three four five six seven eight nine ten eleven right we've got everybody here and every that that's unanimous thank you very much ladies and gentlemen however before you go i'm mindful that we have some new members we have some longer standing members of the committee site visits are a very important tool in understanding planning applications as a board we will be meeting hopefully less frequently than we