Transcript

Well, it's a good evening everybody and welcome to this evening's license in the Environmental Protection Committee. Just before I get on with the agenda can I just mention that I could switch our phones off please, just make sure. Okay, item 1, apologies for the absence, are there any? Okay, thank you, item 2, minutes of the meeting held on 21st of every 2024, can the outdoors be accepted please? Yep, okay, item 3, decorations of interest from members, are there any, no? Item 4, it's actually a license modernisation decision following consultation, do you wish to come in? Thanks Chair. So, this is the report now that originally came to you a couple of months ago on the modernisation of taxi licensing and this is the report following the consultation on the options we discussed at that meeting. We had a response this time from the trade which was 18 responses in total, largely in favour of the changes that we were looking to make. I think it would be fair to say there wasn't any comments at all on anything other than really the changes to the testing regime. You could probably say to that that existing drivers are not really likely to comment on training because they've already been through it so it was a public consultation, it was on the council website and it was widely promoted so yeah, there isn't much feedback on that side of it but on the actual testing it came out as being something they actually wanted. Just as a recap, what we were looking for as part of the consultation was to change the existing VRQ qualification in driver training and the essential skills training that we do ourselves and basically offer one set course instead which would cover what the best practice guidance is saying that we need to do which is safeguarding an English language test and disability awareness training. That would be the proposal going forward for you to consider tonight and the vehicle testing as a reminder was that license holders in the borough seeking a vehicle license would be able to go to any Volzer approved testing station in St Hallens for a standard MRT as opposed to the compliance test. So I just wanted to update you on a couple of things that we've been doing in the background so that you know how this will actually work. So on the training side of it, we've got someone in-house who's developing the training fathers at the moment. Once that package is delivered, we'll share it with you as a committee so that you'll be able to see what we're looking at doing so that you know what we're covering. And then that training is going to be delivered on an as and when we need it based starting monthly by our enforcement officers. So that's the way we're planning on doing that side of the training. On the compliance side of the testing, because I know there were a few comments on this last time. So what we've done on this is we've got now, we will have shortly, these printed books which have copies, duplicate copies within them and basically when someone passes a test and brings us the MRT certificate, we bring that vehicle into the rear of the town hall backyard here and then one of the officers in the team will inspect that vehicle and every matter of compliance that would have been picked up on a test. So it's all ticked off on a sheet, it's all documented, they're given a copy and we get a copy. So if there's anything wrong with the vehicle at that point and doesn't meet the standards that we're expecting, it wouldn't get the license anyway until it was corrected. So you know there've been quite a few questions around how we were going to pick that up so I just wanted to clarify, it would be documented that there's a procedure behind it, Dominik's been developing it in the background so I hope that unless some of the concerns you might have had around compliance but actually they won't even get the license or the plates handed over until we've had the opportunity to carry out those checks. So we've had to reorganise our staffing resource and met people available on days in the town hall that the staff wouldn't normally be in but that's what we felt we needed to do. We've also recently had a trade meeting as well, where it's been coming across quite strongly that they, the three days that were being provided when they could pick up plates from us, they felt not enough. So we've extended it out by way of a role to now so we'll be covering the Tuesday and the Friday as well so that they can pick up the plates any day from us. So I mean that's all I wanted to say on this one. So the decision tonight is we're looking to adopt the proposed changes to the driver training requirements and the proposed changes to the vehicle testing and compliance procedure and so that you're aware if you approve these tonight, the vehicle testing and compliance procedure walk all live until the 1st of July, the driver training is likely to be ready mid to late summer. Okay. Thank you Chair. Okay. Thanks Ryan. Just before we only talk about discussion, it is a good report. I just want to bring attention to some of the points in the report. If we look at 8.2 on page 9, it says that obviously there may be a lot of income to the Council, however, some of that, most of that might be brought by extra drivers paying fees, 13.1, that goes on, that goes on to say we contribute to a greater level of protection for the public as licensing so as we're responsible for completing the checks. I think that's very important that yes, we're changing this or we may be changing this but standards are not slipping for safety for the public and item 13.4 it does say that encourage more applicants locally so that hopefully if we do get that, they do become local rather than going out to different areas of the local city region. So there are a number of points, I think it is a good report and personally, my own opinion is that it should be accepted and approved by opening it up now to anybody who wants to speak. Just as I was really pleased to see how many of the taxi drivers had replied because sometimes engaging them has been a difficult problem but well done have ever organised that. I think it was 18 however, that's the most we've ever had I think under consultation isn't it? Recently yes. Yes. OK, Councillor LOURD. Thank you, just picking up on that point you made about loss of income, I'll take 0.21 years now and mention it could also result in impact on staffing, resulting in redundancy costs. Is there an opportunity to retrain and redeploy anybody that may be affected? The figures that are in 8.2, that's section 8.1 and 8.2 is the simplest way for me to say this, is that it's not a matter for this committee to consider, it doesn't come under this committee but we have to include it there because it does have an impact on another earlier of the council. That isn't a licensing budget cost, it's a cost from an internal service, how they choose to deal with that and whether they re-organise their services differently, we don't know and they may not share that information with us, but I'm sure the council would go some ways to making sure that if they can retrain and employ people they would, but as I said for this purpose is tonight, it's not a factor in whether you approve or not the decision. Thanks. Councillor LOURD, I mention it because it is in the report basically, is there any other questions at all? Councillor HOWARD. Just one on the train, you see the vehicles are going to get inspected on site here, is the person who is actually going to inspect them, has he been trained in inspecting vehicles, is this to do with brakes, was it just to do with, say, glasses or something to do with the account, you know, to do with license and if you like? Just answer that, Dominic's just getting the cost title up so I'll say it correctly, but all of my team have a qualification in inspecting vehicles, so they are actually qualified to do it and carry out those compliance checks anywhere, they have to have it, or we wouldn't be able to do any enforcement with the police or anything else. So you'd be in safe hands, but it's the Liverpool City Council Vehicle Licensing Practitioner course, and the qualification attained is comprised of the following units, Inspect Hackney Carriages and Private Higher Vehicles, understand the legal and organisational requirements when using enforcement legislation, and understand the legal and organisational requirements for the safe operation of a Hackney Carriage and Private Higher Vehicle. Councillor interjecting. That's great. Thank you. No problem. What do you want about, how are you actually on about the MRT? I was thinking obviously the brake side of it, not the steering, are they actually going to test all that? The MRT. Yeah, that's the MRT side and obviously you've got the side. Everything that would get tested on the normal MRT remains the jurisdiction of the MRT. We won't be looking at anything like that. The compliance test, as it was, is split and the compliance things are things like checking the cleanliness of the vehicle, checking it's not damaged in any way, and checking things like the ramps and everything are working properly, so it's all outside of it that's picked up on the compliance. Yeah. So it usually has an extra 15 minutes on the test, so that's what we're expecting it to do. Right. It's just a PSV community for us here as a special MRT test, and I'd expect that from a taxi, not just a standard MRT, but you said you'd get an extra 15 minutes to do the test. Yeah. Thank you. Anybody else? Okay, if you want to come in? Yeah. Yeah, but thank you. I agree with Jeanette that it's great that we got, it's 18 people who responded, that's still, whereas not in the past, that's still very low though, has there been a consideration in terms of how that number could be improved for future consultations, and, you know, what are the barriers and the rain that are preventing people from giving us feedback? We've actually done quite a bit of work on this recently. We're doing the same with licensed premises as well today, so there's been a pub watch meeting this morning that my other lunch, which I couldn't attend because I was on this, where we've brought in the National Association of Pub Watch to help everybody in the borough understand why we need pub watch and why it works. So with the license tread, we already have the involvement of Unite in helping the drivers understand why consultation is important, but obviously we've got a very large private hire contingents, so we've brought in recently over the last few months the National Private Hire Association to come in and work with drivers. These are all voluntary organisations, so they are in the driver's own Facebook groups now, talking to them and helping them understand. We let them know when consultations are going out, so hopefully we'll get more feedback as time goes on, but ultimately it's getting them to understand why that consultation is important. So we've also re-introduced, we were hoping to get trade representatives to come forward our bodies set up, but again, there was no interest in it as consultative bodies, so we've gone back to holding just general meetings with the trade. We had one in March, half-five in the council chamber and put out an opening petition for anyone to attend. I think we've got about 25, we turned up, which was really good, really positive. We had an opportunity to speak to them about consultation, and I mean essentially it was their opportunity to tell us why they think certain things aren't working. Some of the things we can't control, they really want us to be available all the time and be able to walk into buildings, but that's not what's available at the moment. And considering that most of our systems are online, it's not essential. However, they did flag up with us at the last trade meeting, what we already know some people aren't computer literate, to be able to fill in the applications and whatever. So what we're doing at the moment, one of some we Dominic, is testing filling applications in on a mobile phone to see how difficult it is, because what we knew and what the telling us is most people are filling them in on phones. So we may need to do something with that to make that easier, but again, the offer's always there to anyone who is struggling to approach us and we'll work with them to submit the application if it's proving difficult. What I would say is we're not the only authority now working in that way, most of the authorities are working with online applications, so it's probably not a real barrier to actually apply in here, but the other processes we've put in place seem to be bedding in now and seem to be working. Does that answer your question? Yeah, it does. Thanks. Thanks. Okay, I can think the good thing is that it's helping drivers through difficult trading conditions at the moment, it's helping them, but it's also not reducing the amount of safety that we want to see in our time for the residents. So I think that's very important, that part of it as well. So is there any other comments at all? No? Okay, well, something like to put a proposal through then, maybe a proposal through a proposal and seconded, okay? All those in favour, please show it. Okay, unanimous. Okay. Thank you. Thanks. Okay, thank you very much, item five, exclusion of the public. Okay, yep, second. All those in favour, please, please show, thank you. Thank you. [BLANK_AUDIO]