Transcript

I would like at some point to ask the people we don't know in the room to introduce themselves. There's new Councillors here and we don't know the board for DECO, so I'll ask you to do that at some point. So do we have any apologies? No apologies for absence, Chair, thank you. The minutes of the previous meeting have been circulated. We're all new on the shareholder committee, so how do we approve those? Chair, they're just for noting, as they were, the previous administration, and so it's - you're not in a position to be able to agree whether those minutes are correct or not, I'm afraid. Okay. Next one is declarations of interest, and the Councillors here have any declarations of interest to declare. Nope. Public participation. Do we have any questions from members of the public? No questions received, Chair. Item number five is Councillor questions, do we have any questions from Councillors? None were received in advance of the meeting. I don't see anybody in the room asking to talk, no. So item six, for the committee to note the terms of reference, which are in the agenda pack, everybody happy with those? Item seven, Dorset Council's Commissioning Report. This is a report from Claire Webb, I believe. Yep. Thank you, Chair. So Claire Webb, Strategic Commissioner for Education, so this is the standard commissioning report that we present at each shareholder committee, and really at this point of the year, as we're nearing the end of the academic year, it almost serves as a bit of an overview for the year so far, as well. So what this summarises is the arrangements that are in place for commissioning. So we have regular contract review meetings, the Council also attends the Deco Board, as well. It has been a steady state, really, for most of the year from a commissioning point of view, and there's a few things I'd just highlight to you. So there's a particular focus on recruitment and retention, partly because there is obviously just a growth trajectory for the school anyway, but also because we've got a particular focus on the big increase in numbers for the coming September onwards. So we actually have a contract meeting tomorrow where we'll be reviewing the position, but we've been discussing that in quite some detail for quite a bit of time, and we're assured about the steps that are in place that the company is taking to recruit a sufficient number of, not just a sufficient number, but of quality, also, and we've also been talking to them about the learning development offer that they've been putting in place, partly to attract good quality teachers, but obviously as part of retention, as well. So we're pleased with the steps that are being taken there. We continue to receive performance reports and monitoring data, and there's no issues to flag there. I would also just highlight, though, we spent a number of hours with the head teacher, probably about a month or so ago now, going through every single pupil and understanding what was in place, where there were particular challenges, and what was being done. So we're not just relying on performance data, but also going down into detail on individual children and young people where we need to, as well. Couple of other points. So we've touched on pupil growth, so we are on track for meeting commissioning agreement around the numbers, and the school has also been taking steps to broaden the learning offer. So the use of the wall garden is now very established, forest school approaches, and also the community-based activities, which offer a really broad offer for the children and young people, and starting to prepare them very much for adulthood, as well. We have community facilities at the site, as well, and that's now been embedded for quite some time, in terms of community use of the pool, as well, which is going well, and is well-received. The company has appointed independent financial auditors, and those accounts are being reviewed very shortly. And as we've reported for a number of these commissioning reports now, the enhanced cooperation agreement remains in place. However, because the position that the company has got the school into in a fairly short order of time, actually that's been whittled back to a focus on growth, as you would expect, and also a focus on enhanced contract management. So we meet with the company every fortnight, so I meet with the managing director to review the school development plan, the commissioning agreement, and focus on post-ofsted and on teacher recruitment, so that's really the focus that we now are on. We are, as we've reported previously, going to review that enhanced cooperation agreement, so we are focusing on the teacher recruitment, and we are focusing on the embedding of improvements to the work around the curriculum post-ofsted, and we've got a review taking place on Friday. And so this week is really a focus on reviewing. So in the autumn, shareholders will receive a report with the findings from that review and our recommendation about what we do about the enhanced cooperation agreement. I think what I would stress, though, is regardless of whether there is enhanced cooperation agreement or not, what we will have is robust contract management arrangements, so they will stay in place, whatever, and alongside that, because of the growth in pupil numbers, we will continue to have additional arrangements around that growth, so we will continue to meet on a weekly and during school time basis to manage that growth. The other point to highlight is really about the support required around the business case for DECO, and we have in place our internal commissioning board, a group rather, sorry, that's chaired by the chief executive. And the focus there is very much around phase two of the capital works, ensuring that the site is there for and ready to be used for the school at the capacity that we require it to be used for, and works have started, so the contractors are on site, hopefully as we speak, and that work is kind of underway. And there's also the update to the lease as well that's working through, so we're focusing on that. And the other thing that we've just signed and has now been formalised is the update to the commissioning agreement, so a variation to the contract, which has now been completed. So that's it. Thank you. Thank you, Claire. One of the things I was discussing with Councillor Taylor over the weekend was that the reports today say they're for noting. We might, going forward, I think, want to change the phraseology there, maybe say they're going to be for consideration and comment, because we're keen to ask lots of questions, I think, looking at my colleagues. So we'll go as normal. So are there any questions from councillors who aren't on the cabinet, and can you introduce yourself and where you represent, and then when cabinet members speak, can you, for the first time, also say what your role is in the cabinet, please, as well? So do we have any questions from the floor, Councillor Florrick or Councillor Parry? Councillor Parry. Thank you for the opportunity to pose a question. Councillor Andrew Parry, Ferndown, sorry, West Parley, and what I wanted to ask about was the culture of inclusion that's so imperative to be embedded in any of our SEND schools, but have you managed to succeed in keeping that culture of inclusion? Because we have, unfortunately in the past, seen a high level of isolation or exclusion from pupils in SEND settings in other areas, and is this something that Coombe House has successfully tackled? Have you got data to justify it? Thank you for your question, Councillor Parry. I think one of the things that we are very impressed by in Coombe House School is the levels and the ways in which the personalised response to each child is delivered. And we know that, as I was saying previously, the numbers of children that have become on role of Coombe House who were not well served previously is substantial. A number of those children weren't in full-time education or any education at all, they were children who had, as you say, sadly experienced some of those exclusion experiences in other parts of our county. So along with our other good and outstanding special schools, Coombe House is absolutely joined in being in that personalised, really thoughtful approach to all of those children and young people. Sometimes, as you appreciate, especially in 2024, our children are experiencing real difficulty in being present and being in a way in which they can access learning. But what I'm really confident about is that Coombe House School is, as I say, along with our other schools that are all good and outstanding, our other special schools, really leading the way in terms of how to deliver inclusive special education for children. Thank you, Theresa. Any questions from the cabinet members? Councillor Taylor. Good morning. Councillor Taylor, Chicrel Ward, and I'm the portfolio holder for public health, environmental health, housing. There's one in the middle there and there's one at the end, regulatory services and public safety or community safety. If I can just ask a question around what is in place for September, because you've got a large increase of pupils coming in in September and you've got a large increase of staff and you've also got building works going on. How confident are you that the place is going to be in a suitable condition to have some of these children coming in ahead of September as part of their settling in process? It strikes me that we're due now, September isn't very long away, and these children need to be coming in and getting familiarised with their surroundings, getting comfortable to come there. Thank you. Thank you, Councillor Taylor. So we're really pleased with the transition arrangements that are in place for children coming in and for planning and preparation with the teaching staff, as you describe. It is a very, very important part of readiness, isn't it, readiness of the setting, readiness of the families to feel like very, very confident that their child will have a great start to Coomass School, so everything we've seen and heard tells us that that planning is in place and it's being very carefully managed. Supplementary, have we got plans in place just in case the building work isn't completed in time, please? Thank you. I think our middle name is Plan B, I have to say, Councillor Taylor. So our real challenges aren't there with the levels of building capacity, and what we're doing on this site is, as we all understand, unique and extraordinary, but equally, building on any school is always a challenge and what matters most is we're not disrupting the children during that time. We have looked at a range of contingencies, but none of them will ever be as good as the original plan, and so we work really hard with our place colleagues here who work really hard with us to keep those plans on track, but we are at the kind of mercy sometimes of deliverers and providers and of those building programs. We have got timelines with ourselves and the company, and you know, the Deco board may well want to and Andy may well want to reference some of these things. We have already looked at the possibility of sometimes having droppable on-site buildings that we could then relocate to another space so we don't see it in isolation from the rest of our SEND capital strategy, but very much, you know, other opportunities for us to think about classrooms that can be positioned there as part of a plan B, which we can then reuse on another site in the future. So be assured that contingency planning is live and well, and we remain at the mercy of the market and sometimes the weather and sometimes a range of other delays that we wouldn't want to see happen. Most importantly, we know that once we tell a child that they're going to be going to school there, we must try and keep that promise because that's the expectation of us all. Thank you very much for that. That's really heartening to hear from here because it's so easy to have a plan A and not work out what is going wrong, and there's so much can go wrong in these sort of things. So that is really heartening to hear. Thank you. Councillor Sutton. Thank you. Councillor Clare Sutton, Rob Allen-Wyke in Weymouth, cabinet member for Children's Services Education and Skills. I'm on the same kind of theme as Jill, which probably won't surprise you. I think you said we're on target for the 116 by the end of this term. Is that correct? Out with that, and I'm not sure if this is a question in relation to the next paper or in relation to this paper, so I'm wondering why there aren't actually numbers for September, where there isn't actually a figure that we're aiming towards. That's the first part of my question. Yeah, apologies for not including that. I will double-check, but I believe it's 136, but I can clarify that if it's different. Okay, that's fantastic. So that would be 136 in addition to the 126 total? The accumulative total. The accumulative total. Yeah. That's right. So I just wondered if you could ask me to get to contingency. There's also, of course, the issue of recruitment, you know, contingency in relation to not only physical space, classrooms, but also in relation to recruitment. Thank you, Councillor Sutton. I certainly will defer to the board's paper later to them to give you the detail on the recruitment. You will see, if you access social media at all, a really steady and heavy social media campaign for recruitment. Recruitment into all special schools in the region is challenging. Recruitment into special schools nationally is challenging. We know that that kind of workforce is a workforce that has struggled over the last few years, and we've seen a lot of levers within special school frameworks. So very much thinking about what can we do that makes it special and different, and equally retention being a big part of that. But I know that the board will want to talk about their recruitment and retention plans as they present their approach, so if I can leave that till then, that would be great. Thank you. I think Councillor Biggs has a question. Good morning. Richard Biggs, cabinet member for property assets, economic growth and levelling up, a member for Pambry Dorchester Ward. I was interested to hear you mentioned there that contract management was going to be a focus of something that was going to happen. How is that going to happen, and how can we be independently assured that it's improved or always be measurably better, other than words to say that more effort's going to go into it? Thank you. So the contract management that's in place, so I meet as the lead commissioner with contract support, and I meet with the managing director on a fortnightly basis, so the focus for that is the school development plan, and that includes the work that they're doing post Ofsted. We also focus on the performance reports so there's a schedule of information that they have to report as part of the contract, and we also focus very much on the growth plans as well. So the contract management process is essentially business-as-usual activity for us, and what you get through this commissioning report is really the highlights of are there issues or is it on track, and is there any activity that we need to take in addition. So for example, the reporting around the enhanced cooperation agreement shows that we've taken that contractual step where we've needed to, and then we've managed that, we're monitoring it, and we're now in a position to review it. So really the autumn report that you get will give you a good overview of where we're going to be going forward, and what that contract management arrangement will look like, whether we have the enhanced cooperation agreement in place or not. So that sounds very positive, I suppose. Is there any independent assurance that we'll get, other than your warm words, in the report that things are going wonderfully or there's a few errors that need attention? Is there anybody ascertaining to say, otherwise we're walking around homework, I suppose? Well, we always have our friends in Ofsted, Councillor Biggs, to help us with that, and they do, and I'm genuine about that. So clearly they are the regulator along with DFE in terms of this as an independent school. What I would say is that we have a range of agreements with anybody that we commission in terms of some need-to-know activity, and so if there's anything that the school are identifying as something that could be concerning for us as a council, likely to bring the council into disrepute, or anything that kind of is happening that is concerning or worrying around any of the children, we have a very open and immediate conversation around those issues on a very regular basis. We have quite a presence in terms of a joint partnership with the school, so we're frequently on site either having business meetings or visits generally, which again adds to that very open environment of the school. I would genuinely say to you, in terms of any of our commissioned independent schools, I feel more confident about having a real transparent window on this school than anything else, and I've never felt anything other than the sense of real openness and ability to share any concerns that are emerging, because it is so important to be able to do that. But ultimately, the other arbiter of the truth would be Ofsted. I have a question, if I may. It's also relating to numbers, I guess. We've heard that the target is 136 for the beginning of September term, and in our pre-meet, obviously the members of the public weren't there, but there was a number of 280 mentioned, which I think is 2026, so that's two years on, so 136 September, you're over doubling that in another two years. I guess my question is, obviously more pupils will be commissioned to go to Comhass school, it saves the council money. I guess my concern is, is that saving embedded into the children's services budget going forward? We're assuming those savings will be made, and if so, how likely are we to hit that 280, or is that a risk we need to be considering? Thank you, chair. So just a reminder to colleagues that the savings are to the high needs block, and those numbers are factored into the high needs block reduction strategy. So what we know is that actually the savings, I'll continue to use the word, but the lower spend on Comhass, as opposed to other independent schools, means that we will see a decrease in the spending in the high needs block. They are factored in. It does look like a steeper growth, but of course getting going is harder than keeping going, well, I keep telling my staff that anyway. And there is something about the opportunities that are now opening up on that site are larger and bigger and better than we were able to kind of open small numbers of classrooms to begin with. Most of the classrooms are small, and you may want to discuss this with the board. And as I've said before, the classrooms and these schools are emerging schools within schools on site, and that's why we can have some confidence about those numbers getting up to where we want them to get to. But we must grow steadily, we must grow with the right staff, and we have some projection within that, as I say, within the high needs block, but it isn't in any way associated with the children's services general fund budget of the council. Some of the associated savings may well support other parts of the council, replace budget with home to school travel, some opportunities potentially later down the line in terms of other elements, but at the present time, Kumhouse School, not the rest of DECO, is remembering that any change in spend goes against the high need block reduction strategy. Thank you. Thank you. I don't see any other questions. So if the committee are content, we'll note the report, and we'll move on to the next agenda item, which is Agenda Item 8, DECO Report from the Chair of the Board of Directors. So welcome, and maybe you could introduce your colleagues as well, please. The whole of our line, actually, I'll get to introduce ourselves. So I'm Ian Comfort, I chair the board, and I'm going to go down the line and ask others to introduce themselves, if we can switch the microphones as we go. My name's Andy Holder, I'm the Manager Director of Dorset Centre of Excellence. And I'm Frances Nicholson, and I'm one of the directors. Hello, I'm Leslie Miller, I'm one of the directors. I'm also the Chair of Dorset Parent Carer Council, which is the same forum for Dorset. Hi, I'm Sarah Locke, I'm the Quality Insurance Officer. That's us, and the microphone back on. I'm not going to repeat everything from my report, because Claire's picked up a lot, and there'll be some duplication, I think, but I've been picking up on some of the questions from others, which I think we can add a bit more to as we go around. What I thought I'd do is go straight to Andy, first of all, to give you an update on the score, and also can update you on pupil numbers and other matters that have been raised here, first of all. So, Andy. Yeah, thank you. And again, we'll take it that the report's been pre-read, and I won't go through it line by line by any means, but just to highlight some pertinent points. As Claire's already alluded to, we're really focused on growth at the moment, so in the approved five-year business plan that we're working to. This period up to September 24 is the largest step up, both in terms of pupil role and also numbers of staff that we're recruiting in one single window, so it's a real focus for us at the moment, but we are making good progress on all fronts in terms of that. Certainly around our work, the transition with pupils as they come into the school, we're able to be far more personalized and offer far more bespoke packages for families and pupils who need that. And that's leading to them joining the school in a very settled, calm, and positive way, which stands us in good stead for September 24 and beyond where, as I've just alluded to, we're making the biggest step up. People have already commented on, rightly, I think, about the importance of having the right buildings in place for September 24, and we're certainly keeping a very close eye on that indeed as we get ready for that. Works are ongoing. There are diggers digging and builders building, which is good, and I believe the prefabricated building is being built in whole at the moment and will be installed in due course, which I think is tending to be a very efficient way of building and constructing the classrooms of the type we need, so that's positive. We're having conversations within our commissioning meetings with Claire and others about contingency arrangements if, for whatever reason, those classrooms are delayed, but I think our hope and our focus at the moment is that they come in when they're supposed to come in and we'll start the year as we hope to. Other elements to highlight for this committee is that we're really transitioning, as some of our original children or first phase children get to sort of graduation age and reach the end of year '11, is that '24, '25 will be the first year where we have a meaningful sixth form cohort, so there's preparation not only to develop the curriculum and our behavioral approach generally, but particularly to look at how we can make our sixth form provision really, really high quality to match what we're doing elsewhere. Other areas where we feel we're innovating and trying to really push the boundaries of best practices, some of our therapeutic environments that we're developing, so we did a pilot scheme recently developing therapeutic classrooms and also therapeutic dining space, which has had tremendous feedback from our pupils, our families and our staff, so we're continuing to roll out the principles of that, both within our school, but also through the commissioning arrangements we've got, looking at whether there's any practice that could be shared with other settings, and we're very keen on, in both directions, making sure that we're learning and developing and thinking about how to do things as well as we possibly can. Just to comment on leadership, the research around the impact of really high quality stable leadership on any children's service, particularly schools, is really clear. If that's not right, then invariably lots of other things won't be right. We're very pleased with the stability and the quality of our leadership team, which is growing and developing as the school grows, and that is feeling really positive. In terms of some of the comments that have come from Councillors so far this morning about the level of support and challenge and maybe some independent views coming in, we build that in fairly robustly ourselves, so we have tended to invite independent consultants to come in with a particular hypothesis and give a view about whether they feel things are going as well as we do, and as well as the Council maybe do as well. And we've certainly brought in school improvement partners that are independent from us and the Council to come and give us an independent view, which I think is helpful and something we continue to intend to do. In the report, there's, again, not going through line by line by any stretch, but there's a section in there about feedback from families, themes within there for us are around reductions in anxiety for pupils who attend and the impact that also has on the wider family and peers and parents and carers, sleep improving, attendance improving, people feeling that their needs are recognised and understood well at Coombe House School, which is lovely to see, and that's certainly what we aim for. There's comments about warmth and a comment about a pupil who's found their place, which was put into words, something that we're certainly aiming for. So that's the section on the school from the report highlighted. And the only other bit that I want to add on behalf of the board is just to say you're a new shareholder committee that has a role overseeing Coombe House School and the wider Dorset Centre of Excellence and we would really welcome you to come and visit if ever you want to. We're really keen to have external scrutiny with whatever guise that is and we have an open door policy and we think it would be interesting and probably helpful for you to come and have a look and you're welcome any time, just let us know and we'll kind of help you with whatever you want to find out on such a visit. Thank you, Annie, I just want to ask Lesley to add a bit more flavour as well to parental feedback, because it's so important to us. Thank you. I recognise Councillor Saler about the anxiety of parents who are travelling up there who think their child is going to a second rate, why they're being pushed up there. Every child's story is different and Coombe House recognises that, they work very hard. And the best thing as my role as the overview, I'm there representing the parents and I have really good strong working relationship, not only with Coombe House directors and with Andy directly, but also with children's services, so I can see it from both sides of the coin, I can really understand how they're all trying to come to work together and enmeshing and this is such a strong message that's now going out to families. My group has over 900 parents signed up and our social media is very rife, so I can pick up on themes that I can share with Andy, say we've got concerns, there is talk about this. Then I find out that the local authority has picked up, so I can start seeing that there is really good working practice and there is a good partnership. So although you as shareholders must be thinking, what is it like out there for families? We are on a cusp of massive changes and there is positive messages going out, because families are so scared of their children being sent out of county, which actually might be Bournemouth, which doesn't sound far away, but we know children have gone further than that and that can't happen anymore. And with all the innovations that the children's services are now putting in, which Coombe House and Dorset Centre of Excellence is one, there is going to be some really good opportunities for the young people in Dorset, whatever age they are, and I think Andy is just mooted about the sixth form. We are planning these children's future and they are doing it in partnership, so I am very, very comfortable with that. And it's really good that the investment by Dorset Council and by the professionalism of the board and the leaders within that school, we are starting to see changes and it is getting out there to the wider public and it hopefully, well not hopefully, it will make a difference in future, but you are investing now for the future children and I can really see, and the families are starting to notice, there is a difference happening in Dorset. Sorry, I could get on here for ages. Sorry. Thank you. I was going to say just at the end of the part of the report on the school that the child is acutely aware of the need to manage the growth of pupil numbers very carefully. If we get it wrong, if we were to get it wrong, that's going to have a significant impact both on the individual child and on the children at the school, so we do need to manage that growth very carefully, which means that we need to manage the transitions into the school to make sure that that child's transition plan is the appropriate transition plan. We need to make sure that we do have the staff in place before the children arrive and the staff clearly understand the ethos of the school and have the skills to be able to manage the children that are coming into the school. I say it's very critical to us to manage that transition, so although we may focus on growth, we're not going to have growth unless we manage it correctly. That's very clear from the board. And secondly, part of that is making sure that we do have the premises in place, so the building works for September. Having that in place is critical for us. We work incredibly closely with Dorset colleagues on this. We have to make sure we've got contingency plans in place because that's part of the overall plan to make sure that our success as an organization. So I think I'll finish the school on that note, just with saying that the board is certainly mindful of the dynamics of that growth. Moving on to commercial, there's a section here on commercial, the main use of the facility is a swimming pool. That's going very, very well. I'm not going to say any more about that. You're all welcome to come up to the swimming pool, and there is community use of that. We have had an issue with business rates in that it's impacting possibly on our budget. We're appealing that at the present time on the evaluation of the business rates. Dorset Council colleagues are aware of this, but of course the school isn't in Dorset that's charging us the rates, so therefore we're having to be careful about that. But we are currently appealing that, our discussion, and that can, if we can't resolve it, have an impact on some of our financial modeling, but we are aware of that impact as we move forward. And then I'll just move on. You've got a section there on the business plan. Our growth is in line with that business plan, as has been said, and we work very closely with the Council in making sure that business plan is kept on track. We still have the lease to finalize, but that's basically also in train at the moment. It's not caused a significant grief, it's one of those things that takes its time as we go forward. And then Andy has picked up on the need to recruit great staff into the school, and we're on that at the moment, making sure that we do that, and that's been very successful. But finally, for this board, I'm sure you'll be pleased to know, we ended the 2004, 2003-2004 financial year ahead of our budget, as expectations, so that we spent within our means as planned over the last year, and we've appointed auditors to review those accounts. That's a quick romp about the other aspects of our work, and we're open to any questions you want from any of us, really. Thank you. I'm sure there will be questions, and thank you for your assurance that the growth is secondary, you know, in terms of, you know, children come first, and we appreciate that. And thank you, Leslie, for your comments. It's good to see a plan coming together. I'll take some questions from Councillor Froak or Councillor Parry, if they have any, or... No? No? Okay. Councillor Ryan Hope got in first, please. Thank you very much. Councillor Ryan Hope, Weston Ward, portfolio holder for customer communities and culture. Excuse me. I was really, really pleased to read, within paragraph 211 of the report, the examples of feedback from parents and carers included, but did note that all six cases were very, very positive, which, again, is good reading. I'm just wondering if you've done any customer satisfaction surveys, and really, what the results of those was, and did it identify any key trends for improvement? Yeah, so, we have a quality assurance cycle within the school, where we, on rotation, look for feedback from all stakeholders, so we'll do pupil surveys and surveys from families and surveys with the commissioners, so we're getting a triangulated view as we go through each academic year, and we're actually just about to, as we come to the end of the academic year, ask parents and carers what their experience has been like, but we certainly also closely monitor any minor concerns or minor complaints that come in, and it's part of our report to Claire and her commissioning team that, whenever one of those occurs, the council are briefed, the council understand how that investigation is progressed and how it's resolved at the end of it, and that's also kept on a log. Part of the independent school standards is that we need to keep those and note how it's resolved and whether it's resolved to the satisfaction of the person that's made any sort of complaint, and we've got that closely monitored. We haven't actually had any since October, and certainly within my realm of experience, the number of complaints we have from families is much lower than is typical for a school of this type, and I think that's largely due to our focus on developing and maintaining really strong relationships. Just following up with that, again, you say the key is to obviously tailor the school for the needs of the current pupils, are you confident with growing the numbers as per the plan that you can still deliver that standard of delivery? We are confident. There's lots of closely interdependent assumptions as part of that confidence, and certainly a major one of those is us having the correct buildings at the correct time, so we've talked a little bit already today about the importance of having the first set of buildings handed over in time for September 24, but the following assumption beyond that is that the next chunk of classroom accommodation needs to be on track for us by September 25, so we've got a plan, and as long as the capital investment and the classroom conversion keeps up with that plan, then we're really confident with our model that the quality we've reached can be maintained. Again, it may not be for now, and it may be another briefing session if colleagues want to come and learn more about it, but one of the fundamental principles and ways of working that we're prioritizing at the moment is the schools within the school model, so rather than thinking how can we have one very big school at 200-plus and how can you maintain the quality, we're working the campus intersection, so actually it's three more manageable school settings that are a much more manageable size where that quality can be really maintained in a much more secure way, so that's the main drive of what we're doing. Questions on three other points of the report? Do you want to see if there's any more on this first chair, or are you happy for me to ask them? I think Councillor Taylor can come in now. Do you want to ask a question? No? You're happy? Okay. Councillor, I hope that you can continue, then. Thank you, Chair. The other element, obviously no surprise under my portfolio, is I did take an interest in Section 3 of the report, which is the commercial and community activities, and I was really just looking there to say obviously at the moment you've identified the swimming pool which you opened out to wider community use, which is obviously great to offer that sort of facility in that start of the county. I'm just wondering really whatever elements currently of the building and the grounds are being offered out to for community use, and is there a real definition between commercial and community? Because obviously this is an asset of Dorset Council, and I really want it to be used obviously primarily for the education, but obviously I wouldn't want the community aspect of the buildings used to be implemented by the commercial values sometimes, so I think I want some reassurance that there is very much two different mindsets with commercial and community, because obviously at the moment they're under one title. Let me just give you an overview of that first of all. So we have a community and commercial subcommittee, which is a subcommittee for the main board, which focuses on that, and that subcommittee does understand the difference between wholly commercial and community, but it also recognises the need that somehow money's got to come in to pay for the facilities. I think Lesley's on that committee as well, so she can speak about the community side of it all, and Andy can explain slightly more about what we also have on the site. In terms of commercial, you will see in there, and it's quasi-commercial really, in that what we're looking at there is how can we use some of the housing accommodation on the site for residential social care provision, and that would bring an income in and an income that's less possibly than what the council is paying elsewhere, so it's not total commercial in trying to make as much money as possible in that way. And also the main large building on the site, our aim is always to have that as a staff development centre and offer a place for conferences and for training courses, but that's longer down the road. But at the moment, we are exploring the social care provision in some of the houses with council colleagues, and we're acutely aware of wanting to understand that we're not trying to make the community pay for everything on the site. So Lesley, do you want to pick up on that first? Yes, I'd like to, thank you. Concerning the community side, the school is very community-minded. Within the SEM world, there is something called the short breaks activities, which happens during the school holidays. Last year, and it will be happening again, the Dorset Council held one of their big program day events, which attracted families who got children within the half program, that's children on low incomes, so everybody came together at Combe House, we were very lucky, we supported it as well. As directors, we wanted to be there to meet the families, and it was such a good activity day where we got the wide breadth of community and it was supported by local council officers and all their short break providers, so we had this massive community gathering. This is something that garnered really good, strong local conversations and enabled people then to approach the school and say, Excuse me, we have a gardening club. Can we work with your students? Can we do this? And so conversations are really, really active at the moment. We're not turning everybody away. We're mindful of the children that are in there, and we always have to be, but it doesn't stop conversations happening, and we are going to establish a really good community network up there, because, I'm sorry, they are isolated up there, and the families do need us no matter what they are. I felt that the community day last summer was particularly valuable for parents and particularly Leslie's ability to talk with them as a known and trusted figure, and I think that there was value to the school in people getting to know it, but the value was for the families, and that, I think, is a great contribution. There are the grounds, the spaces there. I also think that the use of the houses is the potential for short breaks, the potential for other residential work, and I think is hugely important to the whole of Dorset, to individuals, but, therefore, to Dorset. They are Dorset people, and I'm very aware, in terms of the long term, there is a building which is absolutely suitable for conferences, training, so on and so forth. There is always the potential, if the council wishes it, and it can financially wash its face and do good work for Dorset, to provide places for training for post-16 in developing its work, and there are all sorts of ideas that could be explored in the future, if that was wanted. We all know that, around the country, there isn't a standard training and a standard for SEND caseworkers. Here is a venue which could lead that. Now, that's slightly, at the moment, a pie in the sky, but we've got the spaces. Everything is about – the primary aim is the support and education of the children on our role. The wider role, and there is a wider role, is to share this and to share the good work and to enable and encourage, all of which can only be of benefit to Dorset and, in fact, a much wider community. Okay, Councillor Taylor. I hope so. Yeah. Councillor Taylor, no. I'm actually going to ask a different question to the one I was going to ask, but I might come back on that. This council has signed up for a net zero. I can't remember the date that we've signed up for it at the moment, but I'm just wondering how you're dealing with the environmental impacts of greenhouse, and particularly, we've got building programmes on the go that can often be quite carbon heavy. I'm just wondering what your approach is to dealing with those sort of aspects, please. So obviously, in terms of roles and responsibilities regarding the carbon impact of the development that's going on, those are council-led projects who invest in their buildings as landlords, so that will be a question for officers, I suspect. However, I'm party to a lot of those conversations as an observer and representing the needs of the end user, and I can reassure you that those matters are discussed in their front and centre of everyone's mind. Certainly, some of the older buildings, that becomes more challenging than the building that's currently being built, which is a new prefabricated building, which is going to be really, really high quality in terms of its carbon credentials, and the older buildings will be harder, but it's a question for council officers, I suspect, because they're leading on that project. Thank you. I think, Andy, we talk about playing catch in children's services, and I've just caught that one. I'll come back to you with a fuller answer because I think it requires that, but fundamentally, it's absolutely a part of every consideration we make. There are some elements on site which are really helpful, so for example, the swimming pool remains filled from the on-site water reserve that was previously known as the Nunn's Well. It's not from kind of, you know, so there's some very kind of novel elements which are really welcome. There are some other elements which we need to kind of really work up and think about what the changes are, so how far those children were travelling previously as opposed to how far they're now travelling. I think it's a helpful question because it would actually allow us, I think, to really do some work on that and bring that together. It's always considered, but I think it would be great for us to kind of pull that together into a response for you. Okay. Thank you, and that's what I wanted to hear because this sort of thing is often overlooked with a drive to go forward and looking at costs, and even things like, you know, sort of how much we knew, how much recycled paper is used and all that sort of thing, and how recycling is done is really becoming crucial these days. And actually, I also welcome your answer because I was going to ask about the distance children are travelling, particularly with the large increase towards September, and also looking at, being a Weymouth councillor, looking at the centre on Portland which has been delayed by the DFE. This was not our doing, this is DFE. So whether we are actually sending children further distances than we would currently like to? So thank you. I think the brief answer is yes, we are at present. Osprey Quay does remain delayed at the present time. We continue into conversations with the DFE about their delivery of that site, and we are being as demanding as we possibly can around that. We know how important that would be and how appropriate that would be for so many children in that area. So we will, with my colleague Aidan, we will look at that carbon footprint issue and certainly all of the elements that you have raised today, that would be really helpful, thank you. You can. First of all, can I make a request that the next meeting that we have is actually in a meeting room, because this is just all wrong, you know, facing backwards and not being sat around in a circle. So as an aside, I asked a couple of weeks ago, in fact two weeks ago, that in future this committee meets in committee room one or wherever, it's been rebranded hasn't it, but we all know where committee room one is, it's a far nicer space and it stops this happening. So Chris will probably give us, I think December is probably the first meeting we can make that at the moment because of conflicting schedules and things. Okay, thank you. And the second thing is obviously we'd all love to come and visit, and I'm sure we've all been before, but not for three years, I can't remember exactly when it was, so that would be brilliant. I saw in the report, I think it was at 2.2, that most places are now allocated, and obviously I don't know exactly when that report was written, but is there an update on how many most is, really? In terms of readiness for September, we are, out of the 32 new pupils that need to join in in order to meet the requirements of the commissioning agreement, we are just finalising the last two or three of those, so we really are nearly there. The steps beyond that of really fine-tuning the transition plans is really dependent on us absolutely anchoring down on the handover date for the new classrooms to make sure that when we offer a start date, we are absolutely sure that that can be kept. Just carry on, that's absolutely fantastic news. There's a few other things. I think one of the risks here is there are so many opportunities, aren't there, that we all get really excited, so really excited about the training element, the open the other sites element, but you have to hold yourself back in order to be delivering what your initial primary priority is really well, so I'm going to try not to do that, but forgive me if I do a little bit. So obviously there's a mention of the sixth form in there, but there aren't any numbers attached to that. Are there any numbers attached to that as a plan or putative plan at this moment in time? Yes, so at maturity, when the school is at full numbers, the sixth form is going to have the capacity of around 40 children, but that will occur when all of the classrooms have been built and handed over and are ready, so that's the rough target we've got there. That being said, one of the basic premises of how we've developed is that different areas of the school can be made larger or smaller, dependent on what the commissioning needs of the council are at any given time, so that's the rough figure right now. In terms of September 24, we'll be just looking at one class, so circa eight children, young people by then, who will be the trailblazers and the first children experiencing the sixth form in that year. That's great. Thank you. I've just got one more, which is about the residential social care provision considering options. If we're at considering options stage, is that something that we shouldn't be talking about now? Do we wait until the paper comes forward, or is that a conversation we begin now? I'm happy to provide an update about where we are. It's a significant focus of our commercial and community committee, and we are really quite late on in the planning stages for that. We've had some really excellent conversations with officers in the last three or four months since the last shareholder committee where we've been really trying to push that forward. We are hoping to be able to bring that paper really soon to one of these meetings for full consideration. Yeah. Okay. I don't think we've got any further questions. If the committee are happy, we'll note the report. Thank you. As Councillor Sutton mentioned, I think a plan for a visit is in the offering. Moving on, the next item on the agenda is the forward plan, which is in the agenda pack. Has anybody got any comments they'd like to make? No? Okay. Then the next agenda item is urgent items, I believe, and there aren't any, as far as I'm aware. And then the final one is exempt business, and there is no exempt business. So with that, I'll draw the meeting to a close, and thank you for your attendance. Thank you.