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You You You You You You You You You You You You You You You You You You You You You You You You You You You You You You You You You You You You You You You You You You You You You You You You You You You You You You You You You You You You You You You You You You You You You You You You You You You You You You You You You You You You You You You You You You You You You Okay. Welcome everyone to the May cabinet meeting. Welcome to some Returning faces. It's good to see Janet back on the cabinet after her time off to be mayor of the council. And also, and I said this at the council meeting, obviously I just like to put on record my thanks to council and janitor tell for her two years on the cabinet member. As deputy mayor, she's not allowed to be on the cabinet, so she's now going to enjoy filling in for salim for a year and then being mayor the year afterwards. So that will be good for her and she'll have some time off to do that. And also welcome some of you to new jobs and new responsibilities within the cabinet. So we'll see how that goes tonight when you have to present papers on those new areas. I don't have any apologies for absence. Are there any interest that members have to declare? I think I should probably start off by declaring to non pecuniary interests on the local areas of special character. Whilst I don't live in one of them, I live near one of the proposed areas. And also on one of the questions. I have an electric vehicle and don't have on street parking. So it kind of kind of refers to me, but not really. So just to put that on the record to any other members of cabinet first British. Thank you. I'd like to declare a non pecuniary interest in two items. One is again saying, as yourself, I own an electric vehicle and the second is a non pecuniary interest on item nine. I'm a member of the Harrow Wheel Board of Conservatives, which works very closely with the maintenance of the viewpoint, which is referenced in item nine PSPO. A leader on Councillor Patello's leadership. I also declare an electric car, even though I park it off road. Is there? Me too. Any other? Janet? Thank you. Following on from that, item number eight. I also live near one of the roads mentioned. Thank you. Thank you, leader. Similar to Councillor Patello's item nine. I'm the chairman of the Harrow Wheel Common Board of Conservatives, which is near the viewpoint. And also linked to that. Both of us are actually on the old Reading Nature as a management committee, as is Councillor Ashton as well. And that's linked to that organisation, but also in relation to the viewpoint. Okay. Thank you. Petitions. Are there any petitions? Sorry. Sorry. I'm sorry, my apologies. Again, non pecuniary interest. And I also own a electric car vehicle. Thank you. Okay. Petitions. Are there any petitions from members of cabinet? First of all. Are there any petitions from other Councillors present or online? Nope. And are there any petitions from members of the public? I haven't been notified of any, but there is opportunity. Nope. Okay. So we move on now to public questions. The first question is from Dr. Parvinder Fool. Do you want to come to the microphone? Oh, okay. That's on now. Okay. So my question is, in order to install a home electric vehicle charging point to a property with no off street parking, it's required to obtain permission from the local authority to allow a cable to be run across the pavement. All home EV charge point installers require this permission before they can install EV charge point. So the question that I want to ask the council is, who at Harrow Council is responsible for providing this cross pavement permission? And what is the process that a Harrow resident will be able to obtain this permission? Thank you. Councillor David Ashton. Thank you, Dr. Paul, for an interesting question. We support the use of electric vehicles in the borough and have been working to increase the number of electric vehicle charging points on the public highway and in Council operated car parks. We are hoping to implement additional EV credits by the end of this financial year. However, we currently do not get permission for cross pavement EV charging cables to be installed. It's an obvious trip hazard. Various councils take a similar line. It's under the current investigation. We are looking at how trials and other boroughs have gone, and if they've been successful, we'll look at potentially introducing the option to residents in Harrow. We do want to introduce this. The council approved an EV strategy in November 23, which details how the council continues to support the introduction of EV charging across the borough, including residents who have an electric vehicle but have no off-street parking space, enabling them to charge their vehicle on their premises, which clearly is a far more economic way of managing electric car. To be clear, we want to support people if they choose to get an electric vehicle, want to encourage them, but we need to design out any potential risks in terms of public safety before introducing such a scheme and trailing cables across the public highway, potentially, which is a safety hazard for the passing public. You can have a supplementary question if you'd like. I do, thanks. Is the council aware that the UK government is currently offering a £350 grant to households with no off-street parking to actually install an EV charge point? This is providing that you have installed a cross-pavement solution. Say, for instance, a gully or a cabo charge, which basically is just a cut-out into the pavement that allows the EV charge cable to be securely covered and protected from the public from passing over on the pavement. Now, this went live on the 18th of March this year, and it runs for 54 weeks until the 31st of March 2025. So, in order to submit this grant application, you require or that members of the public require permission from the local council to be able to have this installed. So, how will I, as a Harrow resident with no off-street parking and electric vehicle, be able to apply for this permission from the local council in order for me to apply for this UK grant of £350? At the moment, you won't be able to until we work out the system of doing it. I do agree, you can't have a groove, you can cut the channel across, the problem and potentially a big problem is that you don't own the parking space outside your house. So, you can have the access to the electric cable, but clearly anybody can park there or for that matter, you'd have to have a locking system on it. We do appreciate the problem, we will look into it and we will respond as soon as possible. Thank you, that moves us on to question number two, which is Hugh Brown. Thank you. Thank you, Chair. My question is to Councillor Grieck, portfolio holder for communications and customer experience. For years, North Harrow's Cambridge Road car park has been free to use at the weekend, providing a real boost to the local community. However, I recently discovered that Harrow Council is planning to introduce Saturday parking charges, which will have a detrimental impact on local businesses and community groups. This has come as a complete surprise to everyone and is being done without proper consultation. The only public communication, in fact, was a statutory notice that seemed to be the absolute bare minimum. Given the complete lack of consultation, will you work with your colleagues to pause the introduction of these new charges and commit to holding a proper consultation, aligned with the Council's published consultation standards to ensure that residents, businesses and community groups get the opportunity they deserve to wear their voice before any such decision is made? Thank you. This question will be answered by Councillor David Ashton. Despite opposition from your friends in the labour party and the Harrow labour party, the one-hour free parking, which we introduced, will continue across the borough for both car parks and on street. As part of the usual fees and charges report, which is the way it's always been done, we identified a number of anomalies and changing use patterns across the borough. This resulted in changes, including the extension of charging hours in some car parks. I noticed also, Mr Brown, you mentioned you recently discovered, in point of fact, this information has been available for some time. The Cambridge car park was the only car park near shops in the borough, which did not charge on Saturday, although on street parking in North Harrow is charged with almost Saturday. The introduction of charges on Saturdays in the Cambridge Road car park was presented as part of the fees and charges cabinet report in December 23, and had final approval of cabinet and Council in February 24. At no stage, did anyone for the labour party question or object to these changes? It didn't require discovery. Comparing North Harrow to similar shopping areas, it was found that visitors paid for parking at both car parks and on street, so there is no evidence to suggest. The introduction of charging in Cambridge Road car park on the Saturday will have an adverse effect on visitors in North Harrow. It's fair and right that all shopping areas are treated equally, and that no one area will receive special treatment, which will be unfair to Harrow's other neighbourhoods. Additionally, other factors are led to an increase in residents, visitors and businesses, experienced difficulties finding available parking in many areas across the borough, and the introduction of charging Saturdays will increase the likelihood of available parking for visitors. These proposed changes were advertised and in light with a statutory process, including notices erected and paid for car parks in the borough for three weeks and published in the Harrow Times on Thursday, March 21. It was also published on the Council's website, where it is still available to view and in Green Hill Library. The way we advertise this traffic order is consistent with how the Council has always advertised such traffic orders in the past, and it's the same way that all previous administrations have promoted traffic orders. Thank you. Do you have a supplementary? Yes, I do. I'm a bit surprised to hear you say that there are no adverse effects to local businesses because that's not at all what the local businesses and groups are telling me when I've spoken to them. They're very concerned about this. I'm also a bit surprised your focus is on the actual parking charges, whereas my question is about the lack of consultation, which is why I directed it to Council's Greek. I would just like to remind cabinets of last January 2023 meeting where you've presented with the refresh set of consultation standards, and I'd just like to quote that if I may. The standards say throughout all consultations, it's important to understand what the resident experience is and to make sure that they have access to consultations and the right opportunity to air their voice. We want to listen and learn from our residents, businesses and local community groups before we make a decision. It also commits to being open and transparent, the Council clearly communicating and promoting consultation is using a range of channels. By comparison for the North Harakal Park changes, there's nothing on the MyTalk website, there's no communication to local businesses, nothing on the leaders weekly newsletter and nothing on the Council's social media. I don't think any resident would believe that you've actually followed your own standards in this instance. I would like to ask, how can you reconcile this lack of consultation with your previous commitment to the new consultation standards, and perhaps could you reconsider and actually do a proper consultation on these changes? There is no contradiction whatsoever in my opinion. We followed exactly the route required for these sort of parking orders. We've considered it still being evaluated, and if there is a change made, there will be appropriate signage going up. I am entirely comfortable that if we publish the information through the website, through Cabinet, through Council, then we've done what we should do, and I basically disagree with your comment. That's it for public questions. We now move on to Councillor questions. Originally, these weren't submitted in time, so can I just have Cabinet's agreement to accept these as late questions? Is that agreed? Okay, thank you. Question number one is from Councillor SAD, and it's to me. My question is to Councillor Paul Osborne, Leader of the Council, please could the Leader outline the specific reasoning for dividing the policy policy areas, the portfolio policy areas of cleanest streets and highways, both of which fall within the place director. Thank you. I took the opportunity, given Councillor and Janet Patel is becoming Deputy Mayor, and therefore there was a vacancy to look at the balance of different workloads across the Cabinet. I took the view that by splitting this out, it made a more manageable workload for different people and spent the amount of work that was needed better across the nine other members of Cabinet that we have. Your supplementary? Yes. Why has it taken the Leader of the Council two years in administration to prioritise street cleaning and keeping our bar clean with an overwhelming number of residents complaining that Harrow is getting dirtier? Does the Leader of the Council now finally agree action is needed to reverse this concerning trend? I mean, I would point out that you voted for a budget in your final year of office that took hundreds of thousands of pounds out of street cleaning. I mean, just to be clear, you had a very small increase that had you just read the election and then came out at the end of the election, where actively people on contracts that just ran until the election. We have managed to find money to invest in street cleaning across the borough. I know it's a challenge. I know it's an issue. I think it was looked after very well by Councillor Patel, and it will be looked after very well by now Councillor British Patel, so I'm absolutely confident in that. The next question is to British. Yes. Before consulting on dogs on leads in Bentley Priory, did the administration take into consideration the adverse impact on those with mobility difficulties? British. Thank you, Councillor. I'll start for your question. We don't believe there are any adverse impacts on residents with mobility difficulties. If there is anything that you feel we should have taken into consideration, we're always happy to listen, and we will continue to put residents first in everything we do. It's complementary. Yes. Thank you very much for that answer. The Equality Report within this report states that there is a potential for some members of the community to be adversely impacted if they have mobility difficulties which impact their ability to walk a dog on a lead. How can you guarantee that FPNs won't be issued to our more vulnerable community members who may not be able to follow the rules? I appreciate your concern, and I also have those concerns myself. However, we have consulted throughout this process when we're determining the PSPO. We distributed 2,800 letters to properties within 100 metres radius of Bentley Priory to in February, which included the engagement event dates. We also engage with the voluntary sector to ensure that they have the opportunity to respond to our consultation and given them the opportunity to raise any unforeseen circumstances or concerns. An Equality Impact Assessment has been completed for Brentley Priory. Dogs under Public Control will have the benefit to all users, in particular those with mobility issues. There are benches within the dogs on leads area and in the wider Bentley Priory where persons can sit and take a break with either their dog on the lead or off the lead. If any individual is concerned about specific impacts on them in relation to the PSPO, then we're very happy to be contacted and we're very happy to sit down with them and to take on board their concerns. Thank you. You now move on to Question 3, which is to Councillor David Caston. Can the portfolio holder outline what the strategy is behind the removal elements of free parking in Harrotown Centre, Wheelstone Centre and other car parks in the borough? Thank you Councillor. The proposed changes were highlighted in the annual fees and charges review presented as part of the draft fees and charges cabinet report in December 23. And for final approval, that cabinet and council in February 24. Neither you nor anyone else in the labour group made any comment or asked any questions about these changes before they were agreed in principle, subject to a traffic order being approved. If your group had concerns, it would have been more sense to raise them before the plans were agreed rather than jumping on a few browns bandwagon now. The changes were proposed due to the evolving demographic of the borough, including the number of new build properties, which changed the use patterns of certain car parks in particular, the building of a hotel next to the Greenfield Way car park. Again, one hour free parking is provided throughout the new times. We are one of, if not the only, borough in London to provide this to both our residents and visitors. Do you have a supplementary? Yes, I do. Thank you very much for that answer. I'd just like to remind the Conservative cabinet here that the labour group voted against the fees and charges report at full council. But people in Harro are already struggling to pay their rent and put food on the table. And it seems like this Conservative Council is making it even harder for families to enjoy life with a clear impact on those who are lower social economic backgrounds. It seems to me this is a clear money-making scheme to offset losses from the one hour but all hours free parking scheme. To that end, will the portfolio holder join residents, local businesses and labour councillors and put Harro residents first by reversing these new parking charges set for June the 3rd? That's the question. When do you stop beating your wife, which you can't really answer? Frankly, we are putting residents first. We do look at the pattern of charges. We are very careful and very established in having one hour free parking right across the borough at any time. That is a major benefit to residents which the labour group has always opposed. Thank you. I would just add to that, that labour has multiple times voted against free parking in Harro. I do welcome them to the cause of free parking and the benefits that it gives. I just find it a bit churlish to come in on this particular one rather than some of the other ones. I think Harro Council's offers a very generous parking regime, one of the best in London, for people who want to park and use our local shops and restaurants. You can move on to your next question. Okay, lots of misinformation there, but of course, please could the portfolio holder outline why various cemeteries in Harro are being neglected and not being adequately maintained? This is following numerous resident complaints. What will the administration do immediately to rectify this concerning current position? Councillor Pritish Patel. Thank you very much for your question. Again, Councillor Assad. We have made no changes to the budget from the previous Labour Administration. At present, however, we are short staffed due to unfulfilled vacancies, while the current environmental restructuring is taking place, alongside sicknesses, which is being managed through the correct process. However, there are full-time staff present and based app in a new cemetery and Harro wheel cemeteries daily, Monday to Friday, every week of the year, as well as small mobile crew to attend the smaller satellite cemeteries and burial grounds. These are large cemeteries and staff have to carry out both burials. Sometimes a very short notice for some religious communities, as well as maintaining all the grounds. This is a long process, so the team have to work around the site systematically. There is grass being cut somewhere in our cemeteries every single day. If the staff are not seen, it may be because that they are in another part of the site, cutting grass, carrying out a burial, topping up graves, showing a visitor to a plot, emptying the bins, cutting back vegetation, cleaning the toilets, and any number of other essential start tasks. Our staff work very hard, and I'm grateful to them for their service. As with everything else, Councillor I said, if you have specific concerns or examples of issues, please do raise them with me after the meeting and we can work together to try and achieve a positive solution. I'm happy for us to meet and work something out. Thank you, Chair, for the supplementary. Yes, I do. Thank you very much for that answer. I think dignity and death is really important, not just for those families that are grieving, but also for the people who have passed away. But because this is such a concerning issue, I really want to ask, will the portfolio holder offer public apology to those residents who are concerned at the conditions of some of our cemeteries in Harrow? Because I think this is a really concerning issue. One of the things that you have to realise, Councillors, is that these are not sort of excuses. There are valid reasons behind some of the problems that we're experiencing. One being that of new machinery, you will be aware that within your administrative period, there were no investment in machinery within any of the sort of equipment that we used. What this administration is doing is investing in new machinery up to date machinery that won't break down often, and we're trying to contend with that. Having said that, one of the new machinery is bought, leased through Harrow's often lenti procurement process, arrived late due to lack of availability from suppliers. Another legitimate reason is the weather, which you have to take into consideration. And being a former portfolio holder, you will realise that weather plays an important part in some of the maintenance activities within our borough. We have seen record amounts of rainfall in recent months, it's been the eight wettest winter on record and fourth wettest on February on record since 1871. This has, as you'd expect, affected ground conditions, delaying the start of cutting, Harrow is affected especially badly with its heavy clay soil, which water logs very easily. Add to that the difficult terrain and uneven ground in the cemetery, and it all conspires to make a very difficult task, with that risking injury to staff damage to machinery and the ground. Getting machinery stuck in water log ground, or even damaging gravestones as machinery slips about. This is the reason why we simply can't get our cutting equipment on certain areas until it's dried out. Indeed, some areas remain waterlogged in mid-May. It is important to acknowledge we are governed by weather and ground conditions, with health and safety of our staff, the public and property at the forefront. We can't change all that, but we will do our best to try and remedy the situation that you describe. Thank you. We now move on to Councillor Stephen Hitman, again to Councillor Patech Patel. Can you hear me now? Good evening all. I had a question for Councillor Patell again, so thank you to work out who to ask, but I think it's you. What plans are there for new street signage to inform residents of the new PSPO expectations and consequences? Thank you very much, Councillor Hitman, for your question. A new PSPO signage has been designed for each of our new four PSPOs, as you're aware. The signage is currently being produced and will be installed in the next few weeks. The signage includes a QR code, which links to the new Hero Council PSPO webpage, which gives detailed information on all the PSPOs, including an interactive map. It also has a form where residents can report PSPO offences occurring across the borough so that we can target our enforcement to where the issues are occurring. I'm happy to ask officers to share the signage designs and locations with you so that you have advanced notice of their appearance and can answer any queries about the signage that you receive from residents. If this is something you would be interested in, please let me know. Happy to work with you and alongside you. Thank you for that response and, of course, it would be great to have a look. I guess I'm mindful about parts of the borough, like my ward, which are on the border of two other boroughs, Ealing and Brent, and how people know when they pass from one to the other, what the new expectations would be, and what the enforcement that looks like. Particularly Greenford Road and Sudbury Hill, residents are repeatedly complaining about the littering and the fly tipping and really wanting the council to take action. I know that St George's Prime School have done a litter pick today, and I know that Harold and Hill Councillors will be doing a community litter pick next week, in the next week or so. I guess my question would be, what else will you be doing as a new portfolio holder to put these residents first and to clean up Greenford Road? Firstly, of the question of the signage, we will be putting signage out across the borough's periphery just to make people aware that they're entering Harrow. The new signage will be sort of rolled out pretty soon, but that's that on the signage. With respect to the litter picking, obviously, I'm very new to this role, and I will be looking at in very detailed terms what the issues are, where the problems areas are, and I will be focusing on that and making sure that, you know, it's not just the certain areas that are receiving attention, it's pretty much the wider of Harrow. So I'll be sort of focusing on that, doing trips myself to view the areas, and of course, receiving feedback from people like yourselves, working with yourselves to make sure that we've addressed the issue that you've highlighted to us. So hopefully, once I get sort of my bearings with this new portfolio holder role, I will be sort of much more active in making sure all the problems are resolved. So watch this space. So just before we go on to the next question, just to add, if you do want to look at the locations, as Councillor Patel said, we're happy to share that, but also very aware of Ward Council's knowledge of their ward. So if there are particular issues with those locations, if you raise them of us, we'll see what we can do either changing locations or putting additional signage in, if it's not clear. And just also say, both Deputy Leader and I, and Councillor and Janet Patel, and now Councillor British Patel meet regularly with the litter pickers. We just had a meeting with them today, so we do keep in touch with them, and we are doing everything we can to support them. We also believe the new area-based teams we're introducing will make a real difference to the ability of litter pickers to work with Council officers to coordinate some of their activity in a way that hasn't really been possible up until now. So I hope that's helpful. You have another question, I believe, to Councillor Palmer. I do. Thank you, Leader. Councillor Palmer. Listen, as Harold Hill Councillors, we're really pleased to hear about the installation of ground-source heat pumps in the communal gardens on North Oak Road. Now, the works have been extensive, and residents have been asking whether there are any plans to re-landscape the site once it's finished. Thank you, Councillor Hickman. As you know, we're delighted that we would like to reinstate the grass and surrounding areas, but first what is really important is to ensure that contractually we deliver on our first ever in-hara ground-source heat pumps scheme. Of course, we worked with residents and we're looking at getting a landscape gardening specialist, and we've done lots of engagements with the residents to reinstate the gardens to improve the landscaping around the area. Do you have a subject? Sure, if that's okay, thank you. That's great to hear. Residents would love to be consulted. They've got lots of ideas about what they want in their communal gardens. But I guess I also hear from them, you know, they're paying more in service charges, but the whole estate, I wonder if this is a chance for us to look at that whole North Oak Road estate. Lots of the walls are cracking in those communal gardens. There's lots of maintenance issues. I wonder if the planning of a new communal garden gives us a chance to kind of pick up on those ongoing repairs. Yeah, thank you. I know you're really keen on this as it's in your ward. I think it'll be good to meet with you. We could have a resident engagement group. I think I'm really excited about this heat pump because that will bring their savings down on the energy bills. It is our first unique opportunity to do this heat pump, and working with the residents will help us to get what they want with their landscaping. So I'm happy to meet with you to discuss this further. Thank you. Thank you very much. That brings us to the end of Councillor questions. Now move on to the next item on the agenda, item six, which is the key decision schedule. Can we note the key decision schedule? Okay, item seven is progress on scutiny projects. Can we note the progress on scutiny projects? Noted. Item eight is special local areas of special character. Councillor Māori and Ashton. Yes, so thank you, Leader. I'm very happy to speak about this. We have our chief planning officer online. Good evening, Viv. Like your revision, isn't it, really? Good evening, Councillor. Thank you. I will get deuce Paul for the effort that we've made here. Areas of special character have a massive advantage in that, although areas have to be qualified to be an area of special character, they have to have some heritage elements to them. They have to have some very outstanding architectural merit, and there has to be in terms of a pattern of development and so on. The advantage is that the test is much more easily reached than trying to introduce conservation areas. And as it says in the report, people in areas of special character, local areas of special character don't lose their permitted development rights. And therefore, in some respects, it's an awful lot easier for people to when they're consulted, to think, well, actually, there's a lot of advantages to living in one. In terms of process, what the decision for us tonight really is to recommend the areas for designation, and then go out to consultation, and once that's done, then it will come back to the Planning Policy Advisory Panel and subsequently to the Cabinet thereafter, if it's agreed there, it will then be adopted. So at the moment, our next stage is to go out to consultation and to see what the residents in the areas actually want or don't want, and so on. There seems to be quite a lot of positivity about it, but obviously we're very interested to hear back from them. And what I also would like to say is that this has been a flagship action, and this administration is very, very keen that we deliver on the things that we say we're going to do, and this is one of them, and we're hoping that we'll be able to do quite a few more local areas of special character during the next couple of years, and therefore increase the preservation in the right way of the really interesting and lovely character of some of our more suburban roads and so on within the borough. So I'm very, very delighted with this, and I would like to pay tribute to our professional wing, our planning officers, and in particularly our chief planning officer for their important and all the hard work they've done. And I think this is an excellent move, and we're hoping to do a lot more of it, and I don't know if Viv want you want to add anything to that. I don't think I have anything further to add to what you said in introduction, Councillor Ashton. Thank you very much. Happy to answer some questions. Thank you. Does anyone have any questions on this, Councillor Perri? Thank you, Lida. It's not necessarily a question, but just more comment, we've, often with these reports that come through the Planning Policy Advisory Panel, the Labor Group tend to have more of an input and spend more time on questioning, querying on the policy direction. I think from our perspective, we did that at the last Planning Policy Meeting, Councillor Ashton and the Will Concur, and we're just keen to see what results come back, and who knows, the areas of those particular areas better than the residents. So we're keen to see what comes back and what that may mean for those, not just in favour, but some who may have questions following it too. So, not anything specific for the officer or Councillor Ashton this evening, Chair. Thank you very much. So there's two recommendations on page 16. Are those agreed? Agreed. Thank you. We now move on to the Public Spaces Protection Order, Bentley, Prorie and the Viewpoint, Councillor British Patel. Thank you, Leader. This report is presented to Cabinet to seek approval for the Public Space Protection Order for Bentley, Prorie and the Viewpoint at our reading. By way of some background, members were recalled that the Council introduced the Boroughwide DSPO, originally in 2014, which was refreshed and rolled out earlier this year. This provided additional powers to the Council to deal with specific problems and antisocial behaviour brought to our attention by residents in town centres, parks, housing estates and specific open spaces. The refreshed PSPO came into force on 1 February 2024. However, following feedback from residents and users of the designated open spaces, in particular and specifically in relation to the order to keep dogs on leads at all times at Bentley, Prorie, Nature Reserve, the Council decided to run an additional enhanced consultation on the proposal to receive further feedback. This feedback took place between – the consultation period took place between 20 February and 21 April 2024 and has sat out in Appendix 1 of this report. The consultation received significant interest from local users of the open space at Bentley, Prorie, Nature Reserve with a total of 2,078 responses. A small majority of respondents, 1,150 vs. 897, agreed with the original proposals for dogs to be on leads throughout Bentley Priory with 31 unsure and not answering the question. A larger majority showed preference for dog control measures in each of the specific areas with dogs on leads in spring meadows during set dates, 1,235 were in favour vs. 641 again. Dog should not enter or remain in ponds, 1,168 in favour vs. 602, not in favour. Dog should be on leads in deer path, 1,191 vs. 603 there. With respect to the viewpoint already, we received 233 comments, generally supportive of the proposal to curb antisocial activities occurring at that location. Having reviewed the results of the enhanced consultation, the proposed PSPO controls have been amended to 1. Dogs must be on leads in spring meadows from 1 April to 31 July this year, inclusive. Dogs must not enter or remain in any of the ponds or within water courses in any areas marked in red. And the maps are shown in the appendices. Dogs must be on lead in the known areas known as deer path corridor. Given the responses, the rest of the PSPO including the viewpoint will remain as per the original proposal and appendix 2 gives the full details of the PSPO order. So, what is requested from Kabiner is to approve the recommendations as described in the report. Thank you, leader. Thank you. Can I just ask Kabiner to note that the portfolio holder on the front page of the report is not British, not Janet Mote. Is there any questions? I think Malia wants to come in as well first. Yes, if I may, leader, and only because I am actually a member of the Bentley Parry Nature Reserve Committee. So, probably should have disclosed that, but there you go. And also on the other one, so Ditto, as they say. But more to the point, this actually happens Bentley Parry Nature Reserve to be in Stammel Ward. And I note that Councillor Benjamin is here tonight, presumably for this. Yeah, it's nodding. And I think it's important to explain that, you know, as walled Councillors, we really have found this quite a challenge. I'll admit that very publicly. And I do believe that when we first did this consultation, we hadn't realised that there were a lot of people who didn't know anything about this. And although we did it through exactly the right way, and there was no problem, you know, it was all online and everybody should have known. In actual fact, there were a lot of people who were against keeping dogs on leads throughout, who didn't know anything about it, about the consultation. So, when the result came back, I was slightly puzzled as to why as nearly four and a half times more people wanted dogs on the lead throughout. But that was because the people that didn't didn't know about the consultation or hadn't clocked it or whatever. And, you know, I'm very grateful to the leader. It shows true leadership, actually, to say, well, hang on a sec, this isn't right. We need to re-consult and make sure that it's more inclusive. I'm going to use a colloquial word. It takes a bit of bottle, actually, to do a thing like that. And it was the right thing to do. And what I'd like to say publicly again is, if we have inadvertently, because no politician gets out of bed in the morning wondering how they can upset people, let's be honest. I think we all understand that. If we did, then I'd like to apologise for that, because we hadn't realised that there are a lot of people who did not agree to have to keep dogs on the lead throughout the entire area, who were effectively disenfranchised with the first consultation. And, you know, I'm sorry if that caused an issue, but what I'm very happy about is, I believe, we've come up with a really good compromise here. I think that, you know, it will help a lot, particularly on the deer path, because I know the area quite well. I mean, I don't live that near it, but I do live just off Common Road. And, you know, when we look after our little grand-dog, Rocco, by the way, he's the light of our lives, just thought I'd just drop that in. I can't let him off a lead, because I'd never see him again, but as it wouldn't really apply to me. But having said that, I know the area quite well, and I can see what a hardship it may have been to quite a lot of people, actually, with a benefit of hindsight, which is a great thing. If they hadn't been able to allow their dogs to run around a bit and have a bit of exercise, and don't forget all of our PSPOs insist on dogs must be under control anyway. That is a given throughout. So, you know, if you've got a dog misbehaving, that's not right, and irrespective of all this. So I think we've come up with a reasonable compromise. We hope that both sides of this, what has transpired to be rather a polarized argument, and it was, in some respects, a little bit of an argument, wasn't it really? I think that the fact that we've come up with a reasonable compromise here is all credit to our leader, and to all the work that the officers have done on this. They do say patience is a virtue, and they certainly have shown a lot with this. So I, you know, as a wall Councillor, and I think I could speak on behalf of my colleagues, Councillor Zack Weichmann and Phillip Benjamin in Stammel Ward, and also as Deputy Leader of the Council, I'm very satisfied that we've got to a point where it's a reasonable compromise. And thank you for allowing me to address everyone. Thank you. Any questions or comments? Councillor Perri. Thank you, Leader. Thank you, Leader, and appreciate that introduction there from Councillor Action 2 and the Portfolio holder. I wouldn't mind bypassing the true leadership shown by Councillor Osborne, and Rocco the Dog, and go back to your initial comment around being a ward Councillor. And on the very first page of the report, it says wards affected. It says, Stammel and Harold Wilt, so I just want to ask the Portfolio holder whether or not he feels the recent consultation standards which were introduced recently have been adequately followed in this consultation. The answer to the question is, yes, they have been adequately followed. And not only that, but we also met with representatives of the residents sat down with their requirements and thoroughly investigated those requirements. And we came to a conclusion that the proposal as it stands is the right proposal. So we gave it every effort and attempt to make sure that we've considered all the responses as best we can. And the consultation period was adequate, I believe, not only for the first one, but also for the second one. Thank you. I think that's a great moment. Yeah, thank you very much. Just to add, I mean, I think in this case, not only were the consultation standards followed, but we actually went above and beyond when issues were identified to make sure that we left no stone on turn to make sure that we dealt with those issues and delivered a proper -- two very, very good and robust consultations. Thank you, Councillor PAUSE. Thank you for that. Moving on, if I can, just with regards to the practical implementation of the PSBO, with regards to enforcement. And I know there's detail within the report around our current enforcement team, our third party, I think the exact words are in there. So I'm just keen to understand, just briefly, what's not in the report, who's going to be enforcing, what does the patrolling look like. How does that look like if I'm a dog walker in that part of the world, just to put a bit more meat on the bone to the legal order and the report, please, if that's possible. Sure, thank you, Councillor PAUSE. Yes, I mean, we've already got an enforcement team consisting of council officers, as well as a third party enforcement company, which works on our behalf. Officers who can enforce the PSBO are authorized council officers, police community support officers, PCSOs, and police constables. And what the intention is, is to introduce an, initially, the education, making sure that everybody understands what their responsibilities will be. And we will try to sort of implement that by, from 1st of July, just to make sure everybody understands. It will be a soft introduction, so we're not going to charge it there and start issuing FPNs to everybody. It's going to be a considered approach on a case-by-case basis. At the same time, we're hoping that the enforcement will be in place by 1st August. All officers who are there to serve the authority and who can serve FPNs under the PSBO will have sufficient training to ensure that action taken is proportionate and that adequate evidence has been obtained to proceed with any situation. Any situations that requires an FPN to be issued. So there is a plan of action, there is an implementation plan and a plan of action in terms of how we gradually introduce this. And we will, of course, be communicating that to the general public via social media via any publications that we have. But also, as I said earlier on, you know, we've got a website full of information that we'll give an understanding of what those enforcement signs will look like, where they're placed, and how this enforcement will work. So it's all there for the public to see. And if there are any questions, I'm happy to answer them at a later date as you request. And just to come back, and it's not a criticism. I think Councillor Ashton, when she introduced the second part of the introduction around people not knowing about the initial consultation is this is quite a popular part of this part of the world. And when you only have to look at the consultation as else to see the number of boroughs people responding to who attend, it's not all people from Arrow. And regionally as well, it's got quite a lot of tourism focus as well, given the nature of the area. So it's just around how, if what common sense is there, if there's people visiting the area for the first time, they haven't visited Harrow before, they haven't looked at the website for this guidance. And if the dogs off the lead, and it's dogs walk alongside people, it could be 10 yards away, I don't know. But I'm really animals clearly, but I just wanted to understand and defend some of those residents who may have concerns about it, what flexibility there is going to be within the system. So genuinely, inadvertently, people aren't unnecessarily fine for something they generally weren't aware of. So how confident are you at the signage and that education will be physically available to people visiting the area? Yeah, I mean, I think, like in many cases, when you enter a park, there are rules and regulations as you enter the park that are displayed prominently. And our intention is to make sure that where we have PSPO's effective PSPO's in place, residents are notified through prominent placement of signs. We've got five different types of signs, I believe, and those are going to be placed in prominent areas, entrances and exits or exits and entrances. Whichever way you want to put it, I love the boundaries of where the PSPO's are supposed to be effective. So there will be a lot of signage going around in and around the borough so that people are aware. Obviously, during the beginning sort of term of this commencement, we will be quite flexible and giving people advice rather than issuing an FPN. So giving them a warning or something of that nature, just so that they get accustomed to what it is and to educate them in that process. One more. Just to be clear, we will be issuing warnings first. Yes. And then second. And that will be as the schemes of the first period. I don't know about the first offense, but there's only the initial period to get them to go. Obviously, if we see a lot of people who are saying they don't know about it when they are given the education by the enforcement officers. Then we'll look at the signage again. But I think having seen the sign of design, I think it's quite a graphic sign. So you can kind of see quite graphically as well as lots of words. So it's not hard to see. And I think we've got hopefully the right locations. And part of the reason the lines are where they are on the map is to enable enforcement to take place. And there to be clear points when it's obvious that these are the places where you can have dogs on leads and where you can't. So hopefully all of that will work. But again, if we see a high level of non-compliance, part of that will be looking at whether or not the education was at the right level. So I think that's a good discussion on that. We have three recommendations on page 78. Are those agreed? Thank you. We now move on to the arrangements for supply of temporary staffing service. Councillor David Ashton. Thank you, Lita. This doesn't have quite the same public appeal as dogs on leads, but nevertheless, it's important. This covers the arrangements for the supply of temporary staffing under a particular procurement method called the IPO framework. And the vendor in question is per temp, so we work with for many years. The Council currently has a call-off contract with per temp for the provision of temporary agency staff services. This agreement is set to expire in August 2024. The recommendation for obtaining temporary staff services from that date is to award a contract with the provision of temporary and permanent recruitment per temp on a master vendor basis, which is our standard contractual basis for three years as an option to extend by one to convince on August 6th. The award will be made compliant by the Yorkshire procurement organization, the IPO framework, managing temporary and permanent recruitment. Agency workers' supply is critical and ensures the Council is able to continue to resource its workforce beyond August 24 to a sustainable, efficient, cost-effective model that will operate in the best interest of the Council. And the projected value of the contract over the period, temporary workers' supply contract for the period of three plus one would equate to £112 million of substantial figure. Of that, £112 million, £104 is the actual salary cost, and the remaining eight is the charges paid to per temp and potentially other agency suppliers over those four years. The values given are based on the project, projected based on past usage, and the contract is wholly paid for use. So should the Council decide to pause temporary staff or have reduced it in temporary staff as we have in the past, that will bring the costs down significantly? Temporary staff are critical to the operation of the Council, although they are costly, but on certain circumstances, they are by far the most appropriate route. Thank you, any comments or questions? Thank you. Can I just go on to, I've read the report and not fully understand the model and how it's projected. I wouldn't mind the portfolio just explaining a little bit more about what the Council has done to. And I know the historical nature of this particular procurement route has changed all the time. What other value for money exploration has taken place, other procurement routes, because that isn't necessarily the only recruitment based procurement route out there for public sector or organisations within the Council sphere, for example, because it's a huge amount of money. And just want to understand the fee of the £8m, how, where that benchmark sits in the market for this volume of traffic through it, if you like. Certainly. Thank you, Councillor Perri. We started procurement back in July 23, holding engagements with internal and external stakeholders and spoke to several suppliers on the framework, the purchasing framework, to understand what was available. It's probably inappropriate for me to discuss actual pricing, because that's commercially sensitive. But I will raise two points. Firstly, per attempts have a substantial history of experience working with us, which we think is advantageous. And we will get the benefits of the economies arising from that. And I am personally comfortable that in terms of the pricing that's been done, we've held the line to what it has been historically. And thereby avoiding price increases even in a substantial inflation period. So we have looked at alternatives, but frankly, losing the experience that per attempts has could be very costly. I just had that I can ask that members of Cabinet note the confidential Appendix 2, which sets out some of those figures. Clearly, if we were to have a discussion of those figures, we'd probably have to go into a private session to do that. So I don't think there's need to, but if there is, then we can do that. Do you have any other? Yeah, I just wanted to come back and I'm not necessarily disagreeing with the decision merely, but I think it's important in a scrutiny capacity to ask about that value for money. And by the way, I've sat here at previous cabinets where we've put procurement processes through the governance here for extremely low amounts of money. And sometimes the direct award option is sometimes the best option and often when I've sort of raised that, I think you can save money doing this. And sometimes there is a value to do in it. And I just hope maybe with some of the other lower procurements that go through where you make probably by going to a market, you may not necessarily amount much of a saving given inflation, et cetera, that it is considered. But I did want to just ask about that. I just think it did seem quite light on that particular explanation, not figures, but explanation as to the value for money argument given to a resident doing a direct award for such a vast amount of money. I wanted to at least ask the question leader, but more of a statement than a final question. And I think that does lead into the next report as well around procurement. Obviously, the procurement framework nationally is changing later in this year, which will obviously have an implication of what we can do. But a lot of it has got all of it is governed by those regulations that will replace the regulations that we are currently working under. So there is a recommendation set out on page 130. Is that agreed? Okay, review of procurement. Councillor DAVIS. Thank you, Leader. The purpose of this report is twofold, really, is to provide cabinet with full oversight of the procurement program, picking up Councillor Perry's point to a large extent. For the period April 24 to the end of March 25 and the subsequent two years. This is to ensure the cabinet has an early opportunity to see the planned procurement program to allow for timely engagement to port for shareholders in each of the procurements under the program. And I would be more than happy to sit down with any of the portfolio holders and go through the procurement program for their particular portfolios, if that would be helpful to them. And secondly, to bring to cabinet a review of procurement delivery in the year, just passed, that's the last year, 23, 24, and there were four recommendations which are all summarised. First of all, we're doing the backward look, which is the contracts ordered in the period April 23 to March 24. And here it's important, if justified, which it is, to give comfort to cabinet that we have obey the rules and have done the appropriate routes on procurement, which of course is changing and becoming more complex and I think more effective. In the period April 23 to March 24, 86 contracts over £100,000 were awarded on a compliant basis. 22 of the 86 were over half a million pounds and approved by cabinet to commence procurement and all were given delegated authority to award. These basically are the cut off points required as you give a substantially larger contract. Contracts extended in the period April 23 to March 24. During the last financial year, 23, 24, the extension option available in 22 supply contracts was used compliantly to continue services with the incumbent provider. In the right circumstances, that is a logical thing to do, although it's not very good in my personal view to carry on extending, extending, extending. We certainly take advantage of this when it first arises. All the extensions that were executed are allowable within the terms and conditions of the contract. You would expect that to be the case, but it's good that we can confirm it. All extensions were also approved by those authorised under the financial scheme of delegation, again cut off points for its size. And to that end, all 22 extensions have been action compliant with both the public contract regulations and the contract procedure rules, and they're being updated. In the forward look, there's a procurement pipeline, 2425, and in 2425, there are 78 procurement projects on the procurement pipeline with the majority, obviously, being in place. The number of procurements that require cabinet approval, i.e. over half a million, is 27. And there's a change coming that eat what's called the Procurement Act. The coming financial year sees the introduction of the Procurement Act 23, which has been announced by central government, go live in October 24. This will mean that the procurement pipeline for 2425 will have projects that will be required to follow the current sector of procurement regulations, and under 33 projects will need to follow the requirements of the 23 Act and that complicated selection regime. That only applies to healthcare contracts. A project team has been set up internals of the council to undertake the considerable work required to implement the new regulations into our systems and processes, including a rewrite of the contract procedure rules and the development of a procurement toolkit, and a report will come to cabinet on the Procurement Act and its implementation. This is quite a major exercise, a technical exercise, but I hope it will further enhance and further tighten up our procurement programme. Thank you. I mean, this is a report largely to note and to update members, so I'm happy as well if if shadow cabinet members want to have briefings on either the things coming up or the things that have gone through that that can be arranged with officers and we can go through that. It's only questions or comments. Can we keep the comments general rather than very specific because otherwise there's a lot of specific data. I'm not going to pinpoint an impossible part of the spreadsheet and ask a difficult question. It's a general point around social value. Clearly, the amount of money the council spends is huge and I think what is a missed opportunity really is to highlight all of the social value over the last 12 months of what these contracts are actually delivering, whether it's for jobs, employment, investment locally, and so maybe I'm telling you how to do your own jobs. I don't know, but it would be good for residents and also us as opposition members to see what the contracts are delivering and possibly some themes moving forward as we go into a three year period. So yeah, because although these are hard numbers and key projects, quite right, but some of the softer benefits around this investment is good to read to. Thank you. Social value is something we should report back on when we have future updates. It's often an interesting thing because some of the times the contract in and of itself is providing the social value and you just sometimes by adding social value onto it, you add to the cost of the contract for not getting much in terms of social value. But actually, you can make it harder to do the thing you're trying to do as a council, which has its own benefit, but it's also in a number of contracts, a really good opportunity to get local jobs, local apprenticeships and other things for the borrower. So it's always a bit of a balance, but I think it's important we have visibility on that and it comes back to a cabinet, either in the July update or the future update when we go through this program again. So there's four things to note on page 158 are those all noted and agreed. OK, it takes us up to item 12, the week procurement of Social Care, Mosaic and early years synergy IT systems, David. I think it was it, Stephen, so it says David on my, but Stephen. I think there's four of us on there, so that's the confusion. So this is a very important procurement that we're putting forward. It's the re-procurement of our Social Care, Mosaic and early years synergy IT systems. Both systems came up for renewal at a similar time, so the opportunity was taken to do a joint procurement. And it was these are both market leading products for it very highly regarded. So the decision was taken to stick with the same systems, but work to optimize their functionality over time, which I think is a very good approach. Both contracts would be for initial period of three years with two further annual periods of extension, which is also fairly standard as well. There's there's a lot of a lot of information in the report, but if there's any if there's any questions, then let me know. Thank you. Are there any questions? No, okay, so there was two recommendations set out on page 196. Can I also also ask candidates to note the confidential appendix two, which if anyone wanted to discuss with a need to go into part two, but people seem to vindicate if they don't want to discuss that, but you will obviously will read it and will note it. So can we agree those two recommendations? Is that agreed? Great. Okay. It takes us on to household support fund. And just I'm sure everybody is familiar with this by now, but this is set of funding provided to Harrow Council and all councils to to help people with with costs of living pressures. Again, we've been provided with a with a sum of just under 1.5 million to cover six months. And over the over the five rounds, the councils now received just just under nine million pounds, which is very welcome just specifically for the household support fund, obviously, in addition to the other support that's being provided to people. So there's a there's a sort of a fairly familiar breakdown in terms of how we're providing the support. The the majority of it is is going towards providing free school meals in holiday times. The, the, the previous scheme round four went up to the Easter holidays. So this, this, this one will will take over from the upcoming May half term. And we'll go right up through the through the summer and autumn terms to the Christmas holidays. Then there's other awards such as the, such as the funding again to help Harrow to provide food parcels and advice services through the conversation cafe. The, the application based scheme, which is, which is a, which is a requirement of the of the funding and proactive voucher awards to low income households, especially caregivers moving into independent accommodation. So that's that's essentially the proposal and put that forward for consideration. Thank you. Do you have any questions yet, John. Thanks. I mean, just to say that this is very welcome report, particularly as we weren't sure whether this tranche of funding was going to be coming through or not. Clearly, it's a very, it's meeting a very important area of need. And to that extent, that needs not going to go away by the end of September, or the end of the calendar year. So that's sort of post every historical question. I'm not expecting an answer, but what happens after that really. And I'm supposed just to say that to that end, any attempts to secure funding post September, either by lobbying central government or seeking some external funding to support. And some are all of these initiatives would be very welcomed by these guests. I'm very well willing to work with you on that. Thanks, John. I mean, I'm very pleased that lobbying that we did and other councils did actually got this extension because it was something we weren't sure about. I spent a lot of time speaking to Bob Blackman and David Simmons and through them, trying to get the word to government ministers and when I did speak to government ministers made it very clear to them how important this funding was and what the consequence of losing this funding is. I hope it continues, but I do think we also have to bear in mind at some stage this funding will stop. It's additional funding by government, and I'm not sure it's a sustainable thing going forward. I just don't think now it's the right time to stop it. We are working with the sector, hopefully to try and work out a transition from this rather than a blocked end, especially when it comes to help out in London Community Kitchen and just make sure that that. But also for opportunities where we can keep some things going or make them more sustainable by other gone funding. And I think one of the things we have to look at now is this is potentially the end of this. We want to try and avoid cliff edges for people and try and work with them to have a kind of easier path if it does stop. But my view still is, and I was still saying it's due to government that I don't think September is the right time, or I don't think this is now the right time again to stop it, but it will at some stage I think have to stop because I don't think the government, given a amount of money it's growing, can afford to keep doing this. So it's a challenge for everyone, but I do take the point. So I have a question on this. Yeah, I'm interested to hear the voluntary sectors represented a question on that and it's a question we was asking at February Council and the responses were very non-committal, but the 12th hour, the chance of the exchequer gave Harrow and these vulnerable people are approved and so I'm pleased to hear the leader of the Council keen to see it continue and maybe not just you two and your team. We're happy to work and to continue this funding as well and make representations. I've got a few questions if I can just on the administration of it and how it might work if I can. And to to Councillor Greek, if I was a vulnerable resident and fallen on hard times there's opportunities within the application based element of the scheme, if I lived in North Harrow and done all my shopping all day in North Harrow and there's now introduction of car parking on a Saturday because of childcare responsibilities I shop on a Saturday, but I qualify to apply for this scheme to pay for the parking in a part of Harrow if I was couldn't afford to pay for all day parking in that location. Of course, you do get one hour of reparking in that example. I don't think that's really the place to make that comment, but fine, Councillor Greek, you want to reply. I mean, well, just, I'm not sure how serious a question that that actually is, just to just to sort of for the avoidance of doubt that the House will support fund does not cover parking costs. I don't think it ever has covered parking costs, but as the leader mentioned, I know many residents from many different backgrounds, but especially our vulnerable residents do welcome the provision that we have of one hour of reparking in all our high streets, in all our on-street parking spaces, and in all our council car parks. Can I remind the portfolio holder that that's a leader of the opposition, every question I ask is serious, it wasn't necessarily a joke. And on page 214, it clearly states the eligibility for the application base scheme need a bullet point three people can apply on the needs with support with meeting their day to day living expenses and things such as food and utility bills, et cetera, et cetera. And I understand it's done through a cashew water, how a resident chooses to spend that money in order to go about their day to day activities is up to them. So the answer to your question is, yes, the resident would be eligible to pay for the costs of you introducing parking if they lived in that part of the world. But I just wanted to understand that point because people may need to consider that with additional burden. Can I ask about the hardship fund, clearly within the report and in the past with different iterations, the hardship fund falls within this current iteration? Should this funding port not continue post September 30th? What happens to the council's existing hardship fund? Would that cease or would that then continue as normal? Thank you, Councillor. This doesn't affect any funds that are obviously separate to the household support fund that existed prior to it and exist alongside it. In terms of the specific funding from the household support fund, obviously this is a specific port of funding. It's emergency funding to cover an emergency situation from the government. It's not funding that we can just sort of replace from the back of the sofa, but we would obviously use the existing funds that we have separate to the household support fund in the normal way. I think just to add, and then I think we'll move on this, but obviously if the household support fund isn't extended, we'll come forward with a report as to what if any measures we can put in place or keep in place to help those who are in hardship. Clearly the council has significant financial challenges still when we look at the medium term financial strategy in the budget gap that was in the budget in February over years two and years three of the budget. We don't have the money to keep some of these schemes going if the government doesn't continue the funding, and the funding therefore would have to stop. But there might be discrete elements where we can manage to keep them going, but there will be the discrete elements rather than the bulk of the money which is coming from the government. So I'll take one more question from... The existing hardship fund, which the council runs, that will continue as normal. Is that what the response was? I'll ask Alex to... I'll imagine you'd like to... Thank you, Leader. I think from memory, the hardship fund that you are referencing is about £10,000. So the Household Support Fund element which supports this, which is ultimately a scheme where government through the means of the grant are pretty much telling us the means in which we need to set out the program of support is what the report covers. The Council's hardship fund, as I believe it, and I'll check and we can write back to you for to confirm David is about £10,000 available each year. Just on recommendation 8, it talks about if there's an underspend and the delegations to the officers in the portfolio holder of iteration 4, was there any underspends? And then what was it allocated to? Yes, there was. Generally with a scheme like this, there does tend to be underspends because you're trying to predict what people might take up. So it's obviously there are underspends that come through. Generally, I think the bulk of the underspends went towards renters or helping people with renters and I think there was also some additional funding just for general advice and support. I think working with the compensation cafe. We're obviously restricted on what we're allowed to use it for by the government in terms of the conditions of the household support fund. I can see you're trying to cut me down. One last question if I can, just with regards to moving forward and London Community Kitchen, you can't not expect me to ask about this. It's clearly it's within the Help Harrow scheme and what the reprieve and future of that particular organisation means by way of not just this funding but moving forward given you've had even more time for a budget process as well to consider its long term future and support of. Thank you I mean London Community Kitchen is separate to the household support fund. The funding that we give goes to help Harrow the food the help help Harrow food parcels is worth I think just making clear London Community Kitchen doesn't receive Council funding for its day to day activities. It gets the food donations, it gets the volunteer donations, what they get from the Council is accommodation. So if we get to a point where there is no longer a household support fund that doesn't affect the activities of London Community Kitchen because they don't rely on that. The funding that goes to help Harrow I believe they have a bit more funding available in addition to what we've provided but obviously we would have to work with help Harrow as to the future of that organisation as and when the household support fund is no longer available. Okay so we have eight recommendations that are set out on page 208 are those agreed. Okay we now move on to timetable for the development of the Council's policy framework. This is my report I think so rather unsurprisingly it sets out the timetable for the development of the Council's policy framework. How much more I can add to it than that it's a document that comes every year to to cabinet and we are also to agree the timetable and preparation is that agreed. Okay we now move on to the cabinet advisory panels consultative form and appointment of chairs. Again this is a fairly standard thing both groups have their nominations so can we agree the membership and terms of reference of the cabinet panels. Consultative forms the chairs are nominated members of those all bodies is that agreed. Thank you and then finally we have appointment of cabin portfolio assistance and this is just to note the cabinet assistance that I've appointed is that noted. Thank you that brings us to the end of the meeting. Thank you all very much. [BLANKAUDIO] [BLANKAUDIO]