Transcript

Good morning, all. Welcome to this annual meeting of county council, our first meeting of the new term. I will now run through some housekeeping rules. Social media in line with our guidance on the use of social media. I am happy for anyone attending to this meeting, including members of the council to use social media, provided these does not disturb the business of the meeting. Mobile phones, please turn mobile phones on silent. Web casting members, please may I remind you that this meeting is being webcast live throughout, although I have the right to suspend filming if the need arises and it is open to the public. Microphones members will have to indicate that they wish to speak to the chair and then called use microphone to speak. Please remember to turn this off after you have spoken. There is no fire drill expected, so in the event of fire alarm sounding, everyone present is asked to leave by the nearest exit and assemble at the top car park, reporting to a member of the building management staff team. Staff will be on hand to guide you to your nearest exit. Speaking rules, those that can please stand when addressing the chair and council. Speeches will be time limited as usual. We will be using the time light system. A clock will appear in the corner of the screen. When a member has 30 seconds remaining, the clock will change to amber. When a member's time is up, the clock will flash red. Voting will be by raising your hands or by verbal ascent. I will confirm how voting will be done for each item as we go through the agenda. Item 1 is the election of chair for the civic year. I will pass it over to you. See you exactly. Thank you, Chair. Morning, everyone. So, item 1, election of the chair for the council for the civic year 2024-25. I have received nomination from Robert Evans OBE for Sajus Ains, seconded by Jonathan Essex. Thank you very much, Chief Executive. Earlier this month, Councillors, the world watched mostly with dismay as Vladimir Putin was re-elected leader of Russia with 88.5 per cent of the vote. Hardly democracy at work. Today, in Surrey, we have a free choice and the opportunity to re-elect our chair, Sajus Ains, with an even higher percentage of the vote possibly than Mr Putin received. Like Mr Putin, he currently faces no serious opposition, but unlike the Russian Federation, anyone here is still welcome to put themselves forward. I will pause for a while, but there seems to be no other nominations. So, I will speak in support of Sajus Ains for a second year. Actually, as last year's AGM was held on the 23rd of May, Saj has only completed 364 days in office so far, 24-2024 being a leap year, and so he doesn't complete his full year until tomorrow. That of course will be longer than the 44 days the hapless Liz Truss spent as Prime Minister, longer to than the unfortunate Labour MP Alfred Dobbs served as Member of Parliament for Smevic, who was elected on the 26th of July 1945, only to be killed in a car accident the very next day, or the even more unfortunate Thomas Higgins, who in 1906 was taken ill at his count and died of a heart attack, being posthumously declared the winner a few hours later. Sajus' term of office is already longer than three British monarchs, from Edward V 77 days, Lady Jane Grey's nine days, and more recently Edward VIII's 11 months in 1936. Assuming Saj makes it in office to Thursday of this week, he will overtake Alec Douglas Hume's period of office of one year in a day as Prime Minister. Saj will surpass many a football manager in terms of his office, whose tenures have often been cut short by poor performances or totally ineptitude, like Les Reed of Charlton sacked in 2006 after only 41 days and later voted the worst manager of all time. By this time next year and next year AGM colleagues, they will certainly be a new county council elected, but also, perhaps possibly, who knows, a new Prime Minister. The previous chair of Surrey County Council saw us through smoothly a change of monarch, and likewise I'm sure Saj will use his charm, charisma and genuine decency to take Surrey County Council through whatever changes the next 12 months will bring. Along with all colleagues here today, I wish him well, and it is an honour and a privilege to propose Sajus saying the member for Nap Hill and Goldsworth West as Chair of Surrey County Council for the year 2024-25. Thank you. Jonathan Essex, a second, would you like to add anything? Thank you and congratulations to Sajus saying for being put forward for a second year as Chair of Surrey County Council nominated by my good friend and fellow Councillor Robert Evans. I would like to second your nomination, Robert, perhaps for the few less jokes, for this coming year as a culmination of this four-year term as a Councillor, and as a postmaster since 1986, I look forward to a year when our meetings, just like Royal Mail, receive a first-class service. Look forward to a year of apolitical chairing remaining impartial either side of the general election to make sure that this Council carries on regardless of the changes that happen in the run-up and indeed in the aftermath. To utilise the chair in its key role in ensuring debate here remains within the rules is either neither shut down nor allowed to continue in banter that diminishes the quality of the outcome and standing of this Council in the eyes of the public to uphold the Nolan principles in this place. And for Sajus to look upon us as opposition leaders and members in equal measure as reflected in the Conservatives' invitation for all of the other parties to nominate and second the Chair and the Deputy Chair of the Council this year. To make sure that this gesture is reflected in your chairing, Saj, in ways that ensure the full range of voices across the Council are encouraged equally. To enable no one is left behind, inside, as well as outside the Councillors to favour it, sorry. So therefore, I would like to second your honourisation and wish you all the best of this coming year. Thank you, Jonathan. So the motion is that Sajus saying be elected Chair of the Council for the Council for the Council year 2024-2025. All those in favour of Sajus saying please indicate your agreement. Thanks so much everyone. Therefore, declare Sajus saying to be duly elected as Chair of the Council. Is that please, could everyone stand for the statutory declaration? I Sajus saying having been elected to the Office of Chair of the Council for the County of Saray declared that I take office upon myself and will duly and faithfully fulfil the duties of it according to the best of my judgement and ability. Please be seated. Thank you to Robert Evans, O.B. and Jonathan Essex for proposing and seconding my nomination. It's very, very difficult to follow Councillor Evans remarks but I will do everything I can to make it to the Chair's office to live by his impartiality and I think I have demonstrated that in my last year. I am impartial and I am a fair to everybody. Just to mention, Robert Evans, I did actually have an art attack last year but I survived. But I am really grateful for all my colleagues for having a trust and faith and it is honour to be here for the second time. I will do my best. Thank you. Apologies for absence, Vicki. Thank you Chair. Apologies for absence have been received from Amanda Boot, Liz Bose, Chris Barr, Marissa Heath, Rebecca Jennings Evans, Frank Kelly, Andy Lynch, Michaela Martin and Liz Townsend. We do have a couple of members attending remotely today which they have speaking rights but no voting rights. Thank you. Any other apologies? Item 3 is minutes, pages 9 to 40 of the agenda. May I sign the minutes of the Council meeting held on 19th March 2024, 9th April 2024. That is a correct record of the meeting. Declaration of interest, are there any declarations of disclosure of community interest, significant personal interest or produced interest that members wish to make at this point? The Chair's announcement, I note the sad news of passing of Chris Norman former Conservative Councillor in the Chelsea Division. Chris passed away in April after a long battle with illness. Some of you will remember Chris who retired from public office in 2017, having served two years as a County Councillor. I am sure you will join me in sending a notice to his wife Judith. Barbara Mossgrave, Rest in Peace, yesterday I learned the sad news that Barbara Mossgrave, formerly Councillor Peterman, has sadly passed away. Barbara was a former County Councillor for sheer division in the 1980s and 90s and also served as the Mayor of Guildford. She was a parliamentary candidate in Blitz Valley and a long-standing Councillor in the Tillingbourne Ward, a Guildford Borough Council. As and when we learn of Barbara's funeral, my office will pass these details on. For those that can please stand for a moment's reflection in respect of the last police. [Applause] [Applause] Thank you. Since the last Council meeting, we have had a last Wednesday. We held a reception for volunteers that were nominated by the members. I am really grateful for all of the ones that were submitted and people that attended. They thoroughly enjoyed the day. Lots of pictures were taken and it was really encouraging to see so many volunteers coming forward. I think our County is much richer for the volunteers that help us and I am grateful to the members who bring the name forward. Also to the staff that helped on that one. The other announcements are in the agenda sheet so you can see that. Item 6 is the Vice Chair. I have received the following nominations. Clear current nominated Tim Hall, seconded by Will Foster. Clear, do you wish to say a few words in support of the nomination? Thank you, Chairman. Yes, I would like to say a few words in support of the nomination of Tim Hall as Vice Chairman of this Council. I have known Tim for perhaps more years and I would like to admit both as a colleague at Mall Valley District Council and here at Surrey County Council and I know him to be a hard working committed and faithful member of this Council. He is a very dedicated Councillor. He works extremely hard in the interests of the residents of his division and in fact of the residents of the whole County and I know over the last 12 months, Chairman, he supported you in your role and he has carried out and enjoyed a wide range of duties as Vice Chairman. And Tim as a past Chairman and past leader of Mall Valley District Council is well known across the whole County. I know he has many friends in this Chamber and many friends in Districts and boroughs across Surrey and in fact across the southeast and in fact probably across the country. I think Tim embodies the values of this Council. He has a really good relationship with residents. He is an excellent and open Councillor and he works hard with and respects others. I am very pleased to nominate Tim as Vice Chairman of this Council for a further municipal year. Thank you, Chairman. Will as a seconder, do you like to say? Thank you, Chairman. I am happy to second Tim Hall's nomination at the Vice Chair. Tim grew up in his native Mall Valley going to school but he then left to go to Northern Ireland to Ulster University but then returning home eventually where he became Fetchum West's Council at a young age and he served at Mall Valley District Council for some time. There is clear current highlighted. He was chairman there but he was also leader of the Council for there. And I might say it was back when Conservatives had leaders of Councils. Tim was a very good active leader of Mall Valley District Council when it was in no of all control. But what I want to turn my attention to and add to different words from what Claire said is Tim became a counter caption in 2005 and soon after that he became cabinet member for change and efficiency which is corporate services to you and me. He then became cabinet member for education making sure our school place expansion program was on track. After leaving the cabinet he chaired the Mall Valley local committee and until recently he chaired the planning and regulation committee at this Council. Tim is a caring, dedicated and energetic person that should be the Vice Chair of this Council. Thank you, Chairman. The motion is that Tim Hall be appointed to Vice Chair for the Council for the Council here 2024-25. All those in favour of Tim Hall please indicate your agreement. Thank you. I declare Tim Hall be duly elected as Vice Chair. Please stand for the declaration. I, Tim Hall, having been elected to the Office of Vice Chair for the Council for the County of Surrey declare that I take that office upon myself and will duly unfaithfully fulfil the duties of it according to the best of my judgement and ability. Please be seated. Tim, would you like to see? Yes. Can I start by thanking my proposal and seconder? I'm not quite sure where that person lives or sort of a very admirable person but not quite sure it's me some days but never mind. I think that there's somebody much more admirable oopsies out there somewhere. Can I thank Sarge for his kindness over the year? And I will relay you one small story purely for your amusement because the Chairman's already opened the subject up. Cast your minds to a Monday morning just before the Member Development Seminar. You've put the computer on, you open the email and an email pops up from the Chairman's office saying, Sarge is in hospital. We don't know anything about this either. It's probably quite serious, Tim. You're not doing anything else this week are you? Or words that effect. And we coped and we were very pleased to be Sarge back. It did however reveal to us one of the communication failings in our organisation that we didn't always communicate as well as we can do. From the Chairman's office, my friend, the Chairman and I are very keen to be supportive of all members. We've had some interesting conversation with people in health issues. I rang one of the senior members of the Liberal Democrat group to discover she was stuck in the role, sorry for instance. We've had a series of conversations. Please, if there are issues, we are there to be helpful and supportive as Claire has already indicated. We do know a lot of people quietly. We are there to be helpful. We are there to be supportive. Do users. We are there to be helpful for you. So thank you all very much for your kindness and the wonderful words about some accolades who frankly I don't believe her. I've met but we'll see. Thank you very much. Mr Chairman and members, can I first of all congratulate you Chairman on your re-election and indeed Tim Hall as Vice Chair. I wish you a very enjoyable and successful year coming up to 2025. But this meeting comes at a time when this Council is at a point of renewal. A brief period of some changes that will rejuvenate us on our journey of improvement that we've been embarking on for the last six years. I look forward to welcoming our new Chief Executive Terrence Herbert when he arrives later this summer and he is already playing an important role in how we shape the rest of the leadership team here as we look to add to the outstanding talent that we have at the top of this organisation. Terrence brings with him valuable experience in successfully tackling many of the challenges local government is currently facing and first hand knowledge of how we can continue our improvement and development as a Council that truly serves its residents. I must also give thanks to Lee Whitehouse for whom this will be his final Council meeting here at Surrey before he departs to take on the Chief Executive role of Wes Sussex. There is no doubt that Lee has played an instrumental part in the improvement of this organisation, helping establish a sound financial footing to give us the stability and foundations to deliver real progress. Over the last few years we have faced monumental challenges and the external financial pressure has been intense. Without Lee's work and sound judgement it would have been extremely difficult to navigate through those challenges as successfully as we have. I wish Lee all the very best in his next challenge and I am sure our paths will cross as he goes about that work just next door and perhaps you would just give Lee a round of applause. Following Lee's departure and ahead of Terrence's arrival Michael Coughlin has agreed to act as head of paid service. Michael is of course vastly experienced, has been our Deputy Chief Executive previously and knows this organisation inside out. I am grateful to him for stepping up and keeping us firmly on track over the next few weeks. Members may have seen that this morning Lee sent out a note to all members and staff to announce that after more than four years as a key Executive Director here at Surrey and most recently Executive Director for Environment, Infrastructure and Growth, Katie Stewart will be leaving us in the summer to take up a new post as Executive Director for Environment at the City of London Corporation. Katie has been with us since March 2020 leading the Council's emergency response to the pandemic alongside her day job and an energetic champion for staff in her different roles and again I am sure you will all join me in congratulating her on her new post and wishing her well for the future. That note also sets out details of the revised CLT structure including an interim Executive Director of Highways who will provide additional strategic capacity and give us the enhance delivery focus it requires over the coming months. I recognise that the appointment of a new Chief Executive as well as other changes to our corporate leadership team that are in process can be unsettling but we have a clear vision and a clear plan that we are cracking on with and delivering. Our foundations are now solid this is not comparable to the last time this Council saw such changes to its top team back in 2018. As we face challenges like every other Council we are in the best possible shape to overcome them. The building blocks that we put in place over the last six years are bearing fruits are improvement is measurable and clear we are delivering day in day out and we are focused on our collective vision. We are building a stronger sustainable economy in Surrey we are delivering stronger thriving empowered communities. We are progressing our vision for a greener future in line with our targets. We are putting practical measures in place alongside our partners to tackle health inequality within the county and we are totally committed to our ambition that no one in Surrey is left behind. As leader, as cabinet, as the political administration of this Council and indeed I hope all members are unwavering in that direction of travel and that ambition. Any change to the directors, executive directors, even chief executive will not alter that focus, that north star. It may bring new ideas and new approaches in how we get there but our destination remains the same and our commitment to delivering for the people of Surrey remains steadfast every single day. We started this journey towards the back of the pack struggling if we are honest with a lot to fix and a lot of catching up to do. We have now progressed steadily and consistently around obstacles and through turbulent surroundings we are now rightly recognised as a leading authority. We are having a brief pit stop to refuel, refresh and revitalise and the driver might be changing but we are ready to continue that journey in the best shape possible to kick on to successfully reach our ambition. Mr Chairman, our progress is clear. Just last week we received our latest report from an Offstead Focused Visit to Children's Services which noted that progress for children is evident in the improved quality and timeliness of assessments, the increased timeliness of visits to children and a more consistent application of thresholds. Our comprehensive improvement plan in this area is delivering and children and families are having better experiences, more positive relationships with social workers and ultimately will see outcomes that demonstrably improve their lives. We know that there is more to do but it is evident that we are on the right track and we will not let up on that improvement journey. I am proud of our staff and our leadership who work extremely hard and put children and families at the heart of everything that we do. This is just one area of our comprehensive transformation, our continuous improvements as a council. We are focused on improving and modernising how we deliver our services, the things that people rely on in life that we have a responsibility to provide. We cannot do things in the same way as we always have and over the last six years we have been adopting, adopting best practice, innovating, finding ways to be more effective and use new skills and technology that can revolutionise how we deliver services, continuous improvements. Our current areas of focus in this space include improving the systems and experiences of families with children who have additional needs and disabilities. And as I just outlined, we are seeing progress in this area already thanks to focused investment and a clear plan. Our fire and rescue service is improving with his Majesty's inspectorate recently discharging the sole area of concern following a robust improvement plan being put into action. We are also currently consulting on the Community Risk Management Plan using robust evidence, data and technology, planning and structuring our resource so that we are able to most effectively keep the people of Surrey safe long into the future. And of course, we are on track to deliver our decarbonisation programme for Surrey County Council by 2030 with the recent approval of a new training facility for Surrey Fire and Rescue which will significantly reduce this Council's carbon emissions as well as the relocation from Quadrant Court to Victoria Gate in working later this year. Another important area of focus is the transformation of adult social care, how we manage the high and growing demand with an ever changing care market and how we deliver the very best appropriate accommodation and technology to support people's strengths to live independently for longer. This type of prevention is at the heart of this work and indeed at the heart of our ambition. We must enable and empower our communities and our residents to thrive and to be resilient. We must be proactive as an organisation and as a system of partners in Surrey across health, the voluntary sector and other public service delivery. By making our communities stronger, by supporting people early and by helping people help themselves, we can help prevent people getting to crisis point, reduce demand on our services and live healthier lives with better opportunities and experiences. And we must do this particularly for people and in communities that need us the most to level up our county and ensure that no one is left behind. With our multi-disciplined team around the community model in our adults wellbeing and health partnerships directors, we are working with our partners to do just that, building strong support infrastructures around our towns and villages alongside our key stakeholder partners, the district and boroughs, the police, the VCSE, business and of course the health system. Another key focus of our improvement that cuts across everything we do is our customer services. We want our residents to have a positive experience of engaging with us and services every single time. We want to improve the customer journey, make it better and smarter so people don't need to keep coming back to us. We want to make it as easy as possible for people to do what they need to do, to find the information that they need to find, to reach the solution they need to reach. Our work in this space is huge and it will impact every area to truly make sure we get it right for our residents. This transformation work will help us be an organisation that is fit for the future. We have done it before and we are still doing it and we will keep doing it. The world is changing, demand for services is increasing, new challenges are emerging and budgets are being stretched. We have to be proactive in getting ourselves in the best shape to cope and to thrive. We have to see those challenges and tackle them head on rather than react too late. We have to continuously improve and we are. Another tangible area of that improvement is our highways. We know that the states of our roads continues to be a source of frustration for our residents. The increasingly wet weather really impacts on our roads which are some of the busiest in the country and the road network across every area of the UK is feeling battered at the moment. We are focused on doing everything within our power to improve the quality of our road network. We know that it is our most visible universal service, vital for everyone and hugely frustrating when it is not working, not safe or in poor condition. We are delivering on this. Right now we have 112 surface dressing schemes about to start. We have invested over 8 million to deliver real improvements on 80 miles of our busiest roads on the network. This is just one aspect of our enhanced maintenance programme for roads and pavements which we will see us deliver a further 300 million pounds worth of vital improvements by 2028. We are working hard to reduce the impact caused by works on our network being innovative in the way we use new materials to reduce the time spent on site as well as planning further ahead to coordinate with other work providers. Utility companies, emergency demands in Surrey are amongst the top five highest in the UK and we know that this is causing disruption and further impacts on the quality of our highways network. We will continue to hold utility companies to account. We want essential works to be completed quicker, better traffic management, better coordination and better resident communication to ensure they play their part to manage the significant congestion on the network caused by their works. I will not let up until this is improved and with Jonathan Hully appointed as an additional Deputy Cabinet Member he will take forward responsibility for driving through the recommendations from the task and finish group. We are also scaling up on our own communications with residents about hot highways, providing clear, informative on the ground signage and local bespoke weekly updates and improving how we respond to their inquiries. Mr Chairman, last week I had the pleasure of attending the official launch of Business Surrey. The County Council's new business facing brand and business support service, a platform which is key to delivering our strategic priority to support the sustainable growth of our economy. I was joined by the Chancellor of Exchequer and local MP Jeremy Hunt along with representatives from businesses and public sector partners from across the county. The event reinforced what many of you know Surrey has a fantastic economic story to tell. More than 100,000 businesses here, a great location, a highly skilled workforce, world-leading R&D, creating an economy which contributes more than 50 billion a year to UK PLC. Business Surrey is focused on taking that further using our new powers inherited from the local enterprise partnerships to provide free support to businesses across the whole of Surrey for the first time. By going alive with such a service within weeks of let powers being transferred across the county council, Surrey is well ahead of the national curve. I am pleased to say thousands of people have already engaged with Business Surrey since the website went live last month and I look forward to updating you on progress in the months to come. More progress, more improvement, making Surrey a better place. Mr Chairman, Surrey is a great county full of great people. We have a huge responsibility though as a council to help people go about their day-to-day lives, supporting those who need us most from cradle to grave, to keep improving people's life chances and make sure Surrey remains the very best place to live, to work, to do business long into the future. Our plan is working. We are delivering. There is of course more to do further to go and we must keep up the momentum behind our improvement plans. We may be seeing a change in our corporate leadership team but we will not change course. We will not lose sight of our ambition that no one in this county is left behind. We are a strong local authority, robust in the face of challenging and unwavering in our commitments and ambition. We are cracking on. We are delivering and we will not stop. Thank you. Our call will worsen. Thank you, Chairman. I want to start by endorsing and seconding the leader's comments about Lee Whitehouse and Katie Stewart. I want to thank them for their service to this county council. Although I am sad they are both leaving, I am pleased that they are getting a step up and they are not going far. I wish you both well and thank you for your time here. As one of the leaders of the opposition groups here, it is my role and responsibility to highlight areas of risk for the county council and areas where this council can be doing better. I want to highlight the concerns that my group and I have that this council seems to be in limbo. We have a significant change in the senior staff of this council. Cabinet meetings are cancelled and key decisions are not deferred. That is not good enough for our residents. The leader talked about a need to renew and I agree with him on that. There is a lot of work for the new CEO of Terrence which we fully support his position. There is a lot of work for him to do. I want to also talk about Offstead which recently reported on this council's children's services. I would like to thank Offstead for their report but particularly for the work and dedication of staff in this organisation that is ensuring this council's children's services continue to improve. However, in that Offstead report they did highlight two notable weaknesses. It firstly said that the quality of letters sent out from this council to vulnerable families has a huge standard in variation and some are not written sensitively enough. If you are a parent in a vulnerable situation receiving what could be seen as a threatening letter with insensitive language is not acceptable. Offstead have highlighted that and this council needs to change that approach. Secondly, they have highlighted the consistency and quality of the direct work this council does for children and families. That needs to improve. We need to have a consistent approach across all of Surrey. Finally, I want to highlight the elephant in the room, the financial future of this authority. Really fair for the financial future of local government and Surrey County Council in particular. This government's plans to cut local government funding is awful. On top of the quarter, the 25% cut we've had since 2016, the Chancellor's further plans to cut local government funding could push many local authorities over the edge. When we are just about coping with increased inflation costs and service pressures that is unacceptable. I remember a former Prime Minister standing on the steps of Downing Street in his first speech saying that social care would be fixed. It was one of these priorities. That is a can that has been kicked down the road for too long and vulnerable residents in Surrey for paying the price. At some point, social care authorities like Surrey County Council will not be able to cope. The leader needs to continue to bang the drum for a proper solution for social care. The AGM is always a time to reflect on the previous year, lessons learned and setting the scene for the year ahead. Reflecting on last year, there has been definite improvement. Unlike last year, we are getting Verges Cup. We now have maps of the Verges we are responsible for, although the quality of some of the cutting still needs a lot to be desired. There is definite progress on the backlog of the HCPs. We do have more EPs, but mine works is essentially closed to neurodiversity diagnosis, leaving children, families, carers and schools struggling. The briefing paper says schools were on their knees and that is what the select committee heard on the 10th of May. The number of complaints my group receive on children's services is still very high. The number of children and families in crisis does not seem to be going down, although the service are convinced they are. We are building new, much needed children's homes, extra care housing and we are creating more send places, but the reality is it is costing more than we budgeted, taking much longer than we planned and that is delaying positive benefits for our residents and revenue savings. What will the year ahead bring? Definitely a change in Chief Exec, monitoring officer and many other new faces on the SLT and I will add my thanks to Lee and Katie and wish them well in their new roles. A general election for sure, this is the last year we can all work together as a council before the elections in May 25. The biggest challenge we face is setting a balanced budget by bridging the gap between what we say no one left behind and what we deliver. We all know that the revenue and capital budgets for this year are already under strain and the promise of more Councillor engagement and more budget information sharing is welcome. But there are key challenges clearly articulated in the last year that still need to be addressed and most importantly we need to look at areas of high expenditure holistically. For example, children's social care must not be seen as line items, it needs to be seen as interdependences. We must, as the leader says, be proactive and seek continuous improvement, effectively supporting families when and where they need it, the earliest possible intervention and prevention. We don't get this strategy right, we will leave parents, carers and children behind and the cost and demand for statutory services will continue to rise. Most children taken into care have sent and how we support parents, carers and children will impact how many families reach the point where they just can't cope. There must be a real focus on maximising support for foster carers to absolutely maximise our potential to attract, retain foster carers and allow them to care for our children to the best of their ability and ours. The management and scrutiny of the capital programmes that provide better outcomes for children but also reduce revenue costs in Surrey are critical provision of more send places but the right type in the right place and provision of more Surrey children's homes but these schemes are running over budget and delivery is behind the original schedule. We must ensure excellence in project management and oversight and a clear strategy for performance improvement with openness and transparency. Where is this being scrutinised? Where will the review of the capital budget and the pipeline be scrutinised? Failure to recruit more foster carers and build more Surrey children's homes will lead to poorer outcomes for our look after children and higher revenue costs. We simply must ensure every penny of taxpayers money is spent well. We must learn from the examples of Unit 4, the budget 16.6 million, final cost 27.9 and overspend of 11.3 million, 18 months late and still ungaring issues. To me we are still not getting the basics right. Let's consider the council's core values, our residents being excellent, being open, working together, respecting others. I am not at all convinced that the current situation with mine works or the rollout of the foster carers charter are consistent with us working to these values. Neither am I convinced that issuing letters to parents and carers who are struggling with the send an EHCP system and have done for years and then receive a letter saying they can only communicate with one person once a week, even when they have multiple open issues, is not sharing respect for those residents. I think we need to refocus on getting the basics right, working together with officers, but that officers truly recognise that Councillors, residents and the voluntary charity and face sector have knowledge and skills that can help improve services, outcomes and reduce costs and timescales. My group and I will continue to focus on those things. Thank you. Do you want to learn the ethics? Thank you, Leader. Recent research at ETH, ETH Zurich, found that limiting global warming to one and a half degrees could reduce economic costs of climate change by two thirds and this month research found that the economic impact of a one centigrade rise in global temperature leads to a 12% decline in gross domestic products with costs surprising the uniform around the world. The social cost of damage of each additional ton of carbon emissions is now over £800, equating to £4.5 billion of damage each year from our five million tonnes of emissions here in Surrey, clearly dwarfing even our annual Council budget. Yet the reach of Council has an impact on 80% of UK emissions. Price Waterhouse Cooper's estimated that Council-led climate action would achieve net zero by 2050 for half the cost of a national approach and deliver three times the financial returns and wider benefits. So, Leader, what are we doing to better make the case to Government to scale up our capital programme in this area in Surrey and to encourage similar scaling up across all councils. An honour, a different subject, recent research by the Institute of Fiscal Studies found that sure start centres increased educational outcomes and improved physical and mental health outcomes substantially, reducing SCND and mental health costs and reducing NHS hospitalisations. So, what has been the impact of closing family centres across Surrey and reducing the support we provide to preschool children? That was refused proper scrutiny last year, we simply don't know. But at the recent scrutiny of our child mental health contract mind works, the NHS told us that their medical model was no longer working. There is a national shortage of ADHD drugs and they urged us to support them in shifting to a social model, supporting the likes of a sure start centre and youth work being across Surrey instead. Indeed, in March 2011, this Council highlighted the high quality outcomes for young people of our then universal youth delivery service, especially those most vulnerable and at risk preventative work that avoids costly interventions by other agencies in future. That future is now Leader. Leader, do you recognise and do you agree with the NHS that just like there is a better care fund that recognises the link between adult social care and the NHS, we need to recognise the same links between universal children services, the NHS and schools and put that as part of our commitment to leaving no one behind? So, Leader, do you agree that we should be making the case to Jeremy Hunt, our Chancellor, to once again increase real terms funding to councils, sufficient to provide these kind of universal child and youth services and lead as we can do our climate action above what we do today? Thank you. Robert Evans. Thank you very much, Chair. I'd like to thank the Leader for yet another stimulating and forceful contribution to Council today. I'd also like to associate myself and a whole of my group with the thanks to Lee Whitehouse and Katie Stewart and our best wishes to them for the future. Now, the Leader's theme was a bit of renewal and rejuvenation. We know we have a new Chief Executive coming soon and he will have obviously challenges ahead, challenges to renew where renewal is necessary and rejuvenate where rejuvenation is necessary. And along with the interim Director of Highways, I think they will have similar agenda items to or ongoing agenda items. References already been made to Potholes. I think the Leader spoke about Potholes. That is an ongoing flight for many people in this county. I think one way they could improve highways would be better monitoring of the temporary traffic lights in the spring up everywhere and stay in place even when there's not very much traffic around or less traffic around at the weekend. I think Councillor Powell referred to grass cutting and I think Councillor Furnace for his help in this area but it's a constant battle I have either that the grass is not being cut regularly or often or that it's not being properly cut and residents of mine are very concerned about that as they are about the ongoing menace of flight tipping which seems to have no serious solution at the moment. Also on highways and it's probably not the Leader's personal responsibility but if I wonder if he could use his extensive experience and influence to do something with highways England to see if they can improve the traffic flow around Whisley with the A3 and 25 junction. I look to the Leader to do something in this field and will judge him accordingly because it is hugely disruptive that area as colleagues will know. Councillor Forster referred to the Offstead report and still more to do. One of the areas in there that was highlighted by Offstead was the overreliant or number of staff vacancies and the overreliance on agency staff. Can I ask the Leader what plans his administration has to avoid this very expensive overuse of agency staff because I'm sure Surrey can do better than that. Since his last speech to us there have been local elections across Surrey and changes in many boroughs and districts. The mayor of London was also re-elective and increased majority. Can I ask the Leader if he and his cabinet will make increased efforts of renewal to improve Surrey's relations with London with as we have many borders and many train road and other links. Our fire service already works very closely in cooperation with the London Fire Brigade and I'm sure this Council can only benefit from rejuvenated links with London through the mayor. And finally can I echo the points on adult social care that have been made by others. Children's homes, foster care is referred to by colleagues. We can only hope that for Surrey better times are just around the corner. Thank you. It's open for debate any members who wish to comment or question. Thank you Chair. At the start of his speech today Council Oliver thank the officers who are leaving for their work and I appreciate that and I support that too. However when I started at this Council there were just nine officers paid over £100,000. In the most recent organisational chart provided to me that figure stands at 42. What Councillor Oliver said in his speech was he's looking to add to the outstanding challenge we have already had at this Council. But even today we have an email where it tells us that with one director leaving they are going to be replaced by two new interim directors for years. It does seem to me that we have to end this policy which sees the resolution to any problem being the appointment of another director. And under the new chief executive we need to move towards a much leaner and more targeted senior leadership team and director team while focusing on the appointment of key front facing officers where we have too many vacancies and too many agency staff. Thank you. George Potter. Thank you Mr Chairman. I wasn't really going to be giving that multiple people have now mentioned grass cutting. I think it's and to which I do have to say about I think it's really reassuring to hear that so many divisions apparently have no greater issues than grass cutting to be concerned with. I would make the point that personally I do find it somewhat disappointing that compared but whilst I do appreciate the new online cutting map that's been launched I think is very commendable so residents can see when their verge is next due to be cut and whilst I commend the decision to go back to contracting out the maintenance to the borough and district councils which is a sensible way of doing things I do find it disappointing that at the same time that this Council has declared a climate emergency it appears to be backtracking on the scaling back of grass cutting during the summer months when it is so vital to butterflies pollinators and other insects that the grass be allowed to remain uncut. Obviously we need to maintain clear sightlines around highways and junctions and things like that but it's disappointing that in places where there are no subtle implications whatsoever we seem to have gone back to having an increased program of cutting this year compared to the reduced program we saw in the past years it was far better for biodiversity and made a noticeable impact on insect and butterflies in local areas across the county and again it seems to me disappointing that the as for always be with any change they'll always be both so unhappy about it but it seems to be disappointing but at the first sign of pressure or discomfort this Council has backtracked on something which is making a clearly beneficial impact on wildlife and biodiversity which is a particular shame at the same time this county council has just started the development of a nature recovery strategy please a little bit a little bit more resoluteness to do the things that are necessary even with there might be some criticism. No more speaker Salida please. Thank you very much Chairman. I'm glad that people have recognised that there is improvements across many of the areas and I'll just we will read it just one sentence one paragraph from the Offstead review in just a moment but I think it is important to recognise it to will of cost us opening comments around the change in staff that we have cancelled the council the cabinet meeting in May which is probably the second time during my term as as leader of this council and that in part it is inevitable with a new chief executive coming in that's really important long-term decisions for this council the way he has the ability to to influence those and to be consulted on those there wasn't anything in particular on this agenda that was was that urgent the on Offstead though there was a recognition that has been a recognition about the the tone of the letters that point was raised in the send area review and was the whole sort of communication issue was it was a big point of discussion with family voice sorry and so on and it is right and that and work has been done on those letters don't forget these these these reviews are kind of retrospective so I know Rachel Ward others in here today for personal reasons but but I think she will be able to give us some reassurance that that issue has been addressed but ready to to Catherine's main points around children's service I will read this letter this paragraph which I'm sure you've already read from Offstead on the 17th of May 2024 which under headline findings a comprehensive improvement program has continued to strengthen the quality of support to children in need of help and protection since the last inspection in January 2022 seniors senior leaders know their service as well as demonstrated by their self evaluation they have a deep understanding of the quality of practice and where further improvements are needed I think that that is that is the key part of this that they do absolutely the service does know where it is falling short and the improvement plans and the transformation plans that we have across this organization which are in the process of being rolled out are intended to identify and to fill those gaps I'm not sure I understand Will's comment about the plan the government's plan to cut local government money I would remind you that the chance for the exchequer gave us two billion pounds more for adult social care two years ago billion last year and a billion the year before he also gave a 600 million in February this year as a direct result of the lobbying of the County Council's network 500 of which a million went into children's services and indeed there is a recognition in the Offstead letter about that increased investment in our children's services I think on mine works you know I'm not going to stand here and defend mine works and the issues that we know exist in the delivery of mental health services both to adults and to children all I would say is that there have been some promising conversations with those organizations that that are involved in delivery of that service and I think part of for me part of the issue is the current model where there is no separation between particularly that children where where children have genuine mental health issues that need a medicalised solution therefore referral to sorry borders a partnership as opposed to those that are on a neurodiverse pathway and I think that is what needs to be separated out and there are conversations that are starting with representatives of GPs across the county to see whether or not they can help particularly in relation to ADHD and where you know that child might need some medication on prescription GPs can do that it doesn't need to be referred through to sorry in borders you might also have picked up that Joanna Killian the former chief executive of this county council is co-chairing a national piece of work on ADHD such is the concern nationally around that very issue on the ballot the budget the but we know that the budget is always going to be challenging we absolutely know that and we know that this last year we overspent by a short amount over the over the contingency fund that is what the transformation plans are intended to do not only to improve the delivery of services but also to address the longer term financial issues I like Catherine would love to see the capital projects delivered quickly you know they are the inflation can't pretend that inflation hasn't of course as difficulties and lack of capacity in the construction sector which I think I told is now improving but we are moving forward in building children's homes we are creating extra care facilities for those that want to or able to live independently longer you know we are also doing making some good progress on EHC backlogs as you have said on the recruitment of foster parents it is I you know this this this council has been asked every member of this council has been asked on many occasions to help the recruits foster parents they are absolutely key to the the outcomes for the child undoubtedly are much better if they are in a safe secure foster home so that this is care this is this is not any lack of desire to do that it is you know I think incumbent upon all of us to try and help the service recruit and retain those foster carers Don Jonathan I mean I will continue to lobby government on capital program I'm not sure where the Labor Party is now having seemingly abandoned their 28 billion pound commitment to capital for green a green a future but we will continue to certainly press this government for for more funding it was clear that we we whilst we can address part of the the carbon issues here around transport in particular we we don't have that ability to do it in relation to retrofitting of housing and building houses that are environmentally friendly to Robert Evans I'm afraid I can't emulate your stand-up comic approach my my speech is all tend to be a little bit more serious but actually hopefully more informative but we are going through a renewal and just a period of change that that is good for every organization no organization would should stagnate and you know that is why members change just as much as officers change on your points about national highways we have become very close and that furnaces of myself and David Lewis to national highways over this last week we've had two calls a day with them following the debacle the with the closure of part of the 245 down to a single lane the Member of Parliament for running mean and way bridge bench Spencer has also been involved and because of the direct lobbying from parents to attend the local schools whose children were currently missing their GCSE exams there is they they have put in a ban on the on the northbound the slip road off the north ban a three and that will stay in place for 10 weeks I you know it is immensely frustrating for all of us I mean it is the right thing to do you know the junction ten was the busiest busiest junction on the network it had 300 000 car movement today you know the slip roads onto the M25 should have been reopened by now that was a plan in April but the bad weather apparently is the reason they haven't done that you know it is gridlock anybody coming down you know down to the A3 from along the M25 and of course the massive impact for in particularly my residents in way bridge and in Cobham where we are seeing the displacement of the traffic off the M25 so they are national highways is an interesting organisation to deal with has to be said but we will continue to to lobby them to not only to do this work as quickly as possible but to to try and recognize the disruption that these works are causing to all of us on your other point I would absolutely delighted to welcome them the the mayor of London and representatives from TFL down to Surrey with an offer on the compensation around the EULA's fines that he has introduced so perhaps he should be passed that back to him then whenever whenever he's got the time to come down to regate we'd be delighted to see him or we might even manage to put on a lunch for him you never know to Eva Kington yes of course Eva as ever you know your usual point I would say that you mentioned the cost of or the number of people that's that are on a hundred thousand pounds here at nine nine when you started in about 1950 or whatever it was you first joined the county there has been some inflation since then Michael and Michael Coughlin and Casey will both be living which is why they're being replaced with an identical number of two people you know in terms of recruitment and retention of staff we have seen a better rate within children's services we do have a because I'm the called Connect to Surrey which is a joint recruitment agency that we use with Kent County Council for the recruitment interim staff and we have seen some success in converting interim social workers agency workers into permanent staff it is social work is it's a it's a difficult area though that there are a lot of people that do that job it's a very very demanding job and a lot of them want to do it on a kind of an agency basis rather than on a permanent basis but we are doing everything we possibly can the the that that by setting up that joint that joint venture though it has reduced significantly the cost of agency staff but it is our absolute ambition to get that down as much as we possibly can but we have to make sure that we have the people in the front line doing those roles and I think I know George Potter's comments I think as always you know for for every resident has one view there's a resident that has a different view you know Robert Evans lights his verge is cut to death whereas others don't but I do think we have a blue heart scheme my understanding is that residents are encouraged to identify areas where they're happy that the grass is left to grow and of course we could do have no mo may at the moment but but you know it is absolutely right that we get a sensible balance between you know severe verge cutting and allowing those allowing that at that biodiversity so thank you very much Chair. Point of order is understanding order 16.1c which enables the members who's already spoken they may at the chim's direction rebut a personal allegation just to say that I wasn't born in 1950 thank you for that right item eight is the changes to cabinet portfolios some pages 41 to 42 of the agenda the leader could you please introduce the report polity share yes there's a one small amendment to the cabinet and that's Jonathan Halle will be joining as a deputy cabinet member for strategic highways any debate on that George Potter um mr chairman I'm on record as having requested previously in the past that if changes to cabinet portfolios are due to become an almost standing item that the reports should highlight what specific positions have changed I'm grateful to the leader therefore for for the point from verbally indicating it even if the report doesn't that we appear to have lost the deputy cabinet member for customer and communities but have gained one for strategic highways. Andy Warhol famously remarked that in the future everyone will be famous for 15 minutes perhaps he should have said that in the in the future every conservative counselor will be a deputy cabinet member for 15 for 15 minutes but while some may look asking at this I formed like to commend the council leader for his commendably equitable and egalitarian approach he may have had more reshuffles than a DJ but no one could accuse him of leaving talent languishing on the backbenches and I for one look forward to seeing the next round of cabinet changes at the next council meeting and indeed the one after that and the one after that any other speakers recommendation is council's asked to note the leaders change to the cabinet noted I'll be agreed please raise your hands thank you item nine any review of the political prosperity pages five to eight of the first supplementary agenda I refer to the report the monitoring officers in the first government agenda the item is open for debate the recommendation is on page six of the first supplementary agenda and is the council adopt the scheme of proportionality has sat out in a annex one to this report for the council year 2024-25 I'll be agreed please raise your hands here item 10 appointment of committees pages nine to 16 of the first supplementary agenda I refer to the nominations in the first supplementary agenda I have been notified by the concept of group that they wish to add Tim Hall has an additional substitute to the planning regulatory committee the item is open for debate the recommendations are pages 16 of the first supplementary agenda and are to appoint members to serve on the committees of the council for the year 2024-25 in accordance with the wishes of political groups to authorize the chief executive to make changes to the membership of any of the council's committees as necessary during the council year in accordance with the wishes of the political groups to appoint the council's representatives to the Surrey police and crime panel for the year 24-25 to appoint up to two members to the Buckinghamshire county council and Surrey county council joint trading standards service committee one of whom must be cabinet member the other in an advisory non-voting role to note the leader's appointment to the council's executive committee has outlined above are we agreed please raise your hands election of committee chairman and wash chairman this is on pages 17 and 18 the first supplementary agenda I refer to the nomination in the first supplementary agenda the item is open for debate nor debate the recommendations on page 18 of first preliminary agenda is that the members listed are duly elected as chairman and vice chairman respectively of the select committees regulatory committees as shown for 24-25 are we agreed agreed appointment of an interim head of page services pages 43-44 I'll call the leader as a chairman of the people's performance and development committee to introduce the report thank you thank you chairman I don't think this really needs much introduction I think everybody's aware that Michael Kofland has postponed his retirement from this authority and will take over his head of paid service with effects from the 31st of may which will be Lee White House's last day and will stay with us until I think August the 16th which is the Friday just before Terrence Herbert arrives on the on Monday the 19th of August so just ready to thank to record my thanks to Michael for taking on the recommendations on pages 43 of your agenda and is that the county council appoints Michael Kofland attracted head of page service sorry county council from 30 June 2024 until 18 August 2024 are we agreed agreed a former independent member of the audit and governance committee this is on pages 45-48 of the agenda I call the chairman of the audit and governance committee Victor to introduce the report thank you very much mr chairman so just very quickly the report in front of you all relates to the appointment of the new independent member of the audit governance committee and that's following the resignation of the previous member that was mr Terry Price I would just like taste the opportunity to thank Terry for all his work over the last two years on the audit committee and for all his experience and expertise on that committee following an interview process which was carried out by myself mr Richard Tear mr mccormack and mr Will Forster we unanimously decided to offer the role to mr Matthew Woods all panel members concluded that mr Woods had the breadth of experience and knowledge which is very suitable for this role thank you very much item open for debate the recommendations are page 46 that council agrees to the appointment of Matthew Woods has the independent member of the audit and governance committee for the period of four four years are we agreed item 14 amendments to the constitution pages 49 to 70 of the agenda I note the proposed changes to part three and six of the constitution the items open for debate recommendations are pages 52 of your agenda and are that the recommend amendment to part three section three part four of the constitution has set out in paragraph three if this report be approved that the revise office of court of conduct panel part six oh three has set out in the annex one to this report be approved that the changes to part three section two of the constitution scheme of delegation made by the leader on the 26th of March 2024 be noted are we agreed item 15 members question time pages 5 to 22 of the seconds of our agenda notice has been received of 13 questions there will be a five minutes per question for subcommittee questions on the questions please please be brief these must be framed as questions and not statements and must be relevant to the original question question time will be limited to 45 minutes at which point I will finish the question we are on and close the item any questions not covered during the 45 minutes written on so has been tabled and members can of course follow up with the relevant cabinet member outside the meeting moving on to the questions first question is from Robert Evans to Matt furnace thank you very much chair I'd like to thank the cabinet member for his answer although actually of course it really just lists the current situation rather than my question is about progress but can I ask him what discussions has he had with the other councils the airport and any other interested agencies and will he encourage those responsible as time is going on and no real progress is being made it seems to will he encourage those responsible to look closely at not just the schemes currently under consideration but possibly some of the more of imaginative options that are now becoming aware from abroad from Japan China for example magnetic trams and finally when the conclusions this work or the interim conclusions become available in June we need to perhaps report back to council to let us know an update on how we're getting on thank you any other supplementary thank you chair thank you council overs for your supplementary question I think this is fair to be saying this has been a debate that's been rolling on for quite a few years now this piece of work between ourselves Heathrow airport and and spell form as well I think we'll hopefully bottom out a preferred route that we can all get behind and support personally and this council has always said we support the southern library the rail link which is currently the bus service we're looking at how we can enhance that with Heathrow airports as well providing additional stop points so that they can access out of the M25 to avoid the dreaded Ules that has been implemented as well as the parking charges that the airports has put in place as well so I think it would be best actually if we wait till June let's bottom out the answer see if we can get all the authorities behind one particular proposal and then move on from there thank you second question is from Catherine Powell final note in so on so way clear current Catherine thank you chair like to thank the cabinet member for her long response and for recognizing that disadvantaged children and young people have been disproportionately affected I am however unclear from the responses to what targeted provision is being provided to disadvantaged young children and young people and would ask the cabinet member to please provide the list of schools that have been prioritized for support to hopefully improve my understanding thank you chair any other supplementary Claire thank you chairman in my response I gave quite a lot of detail about the work that we're doing particularly in the early years with the extension of the early years entitlement particularly around those children who are eligible for the free early years education offer which is specifically targeted at deprived children from a more deprived background disadvantage background but I gather that the councilor's question is more around the provision in schools and one thing I would like to say is that obviously this school does not run control or manage any schools in the council sorry in the county and we do not have a direct relationship with schools individually standards in schools are predominantly the responsibility of school governors and head teachers of every single school are accountable to their board of governors or if they're in a trust to to the trustees so when I have spoken in the the response about our education partnership and how that is particularly has a priority about raising that attainment of disadvantaged group or closing the attainment gap that can only be done through working in partnership chairman we do not have direct authority over schools we do not have direct influence over schools or the way they deliver their curriculum or the way that they teach that sits with governors so our partnership our education partnership the delivery of our lifetime of learning strategy which talks about closing that attainment gap must be a partnership it must be an equal partnership working with schools with school leaders with the Surrey Alliance for Excellence which is our school improvement partnership and trying to bring everybody together to work together to close that attainment gap and I will say that the attainment gap in Surrey is probably more acute than in very many other counties our high performing children achieve incredibly well but we do have a large number of children who do less well than that appears in other counties in other education areas we know a lot of work has been done on this in London we know a lot of work has been done on this in the London powerhouse sorry in the northern powerhouse where they have collectively um as partnerships come together to focus on raising that attainment gap and bringing up educational attainment of those who come from more disadvantaged backgrounds but it can only be done in schools it can only be done in partnership I'm happy to talk to the member more about the the work that this partnership is doing it is in its early days but it can only be a partnership of the willing we can only bring along those schools and those school leaders who want to be involved and want to take this initiative further but I'll be very happy to speak to her but in terms of what this council is doing to focus um work in individual schools there isn't that that that information it's something that's done through the Surrey Alliance for Excellence our school improvement partner not directly by this authority thank you champ. Question three from Jordan Essex to Kevin Dinnis do you have a supplementary care? I'd like to start just by thanking the cabinet member Kevin Dinnis for his answer and in light of the answer noting that Surrey police have extended their offer of a lease until 2026 and and residents concerns including raised to me by email yesterday regarding a major house fire on Sunday the 12th of May this year in Banstead which completely destroyed the house and surrounding woodlands but thankfully didn't spread any further is it possible to confirm please how the the station the Banstead fire station in its huge police own setting cannot be made fit for purpose and in the meantime that Surrey County Council accept a one-year extension to the current lease of Banstead fire station which has been put forward by Surrey police already as this would seem to make sense and allow time to look into this proposed closure more closely and properly consider the alternative options and also may may I request that the extra details shared in this answer be put on the consultation website so all those seeking to respond to the current consultation can see the facts that have been outlined and shared today thank you. Robert Evans thank you chair in the cabinet members response paragraph D subsection three it says the crews and equipment are moving not being removed and the services minimum availability of fire engines will not change 20 in the day and 16 at night is he aware that a similar assurance was given in spell form when two fire stations were closed and one new one opened that the fire cover would not change but then of course later on the cover was reduced at night. Can the cabinet member give us assurances that this is the in fact the case for Banstead and also what Surrey wide can you give us assurances that there are no further closures of fire stations or reductions in service in the pipeline thank you. Rebecca Paul thank you chair and firstly can I start by thanking council adenas for meeting with myself and councillor luke Bennett last week to discuss our concerns around the proposed closure of Banstead fire station and in your response you provided really useful information about the response times before and after the proposal specifically to Banstead village and can we ask that we are also provided with that same information for the following villages Tadworth, Walton, Kingswood, Berheath, Chipps did and Woodmanston thank you. Steve will call me. Thank you chair. My question of concern is that the the an appliance was moved from Epson station to Banstead reducing the number of appliances available at Epson the backup and submental cover was to be provided by Banstead for Epson in your area. With the proposed closure of Banstead will Epson station return back to two appliances and if not what is the plan to provide Epson renewal with enough coverage and how will this be done. What's chair? I will start by thanking the cat I remember very much for a very interesting response having been here a long while I do remember previous discussions about fire stations very heavily. There is a slight dichotomy between what our public see and the realities of how the fire service works. However, I think the thing which would be very helpful to all members if a better explanation of the mapping and why white leaf is a preferred option because I suspect it probably makes a lot of sense once you get the maps out and have a look and I know the chief fire officer in the previous guys when he was assistant chief fire officer did a sterling job of explaining it. Can I suggest a member seminar or a member briefing to explain with the maps why and how it all fits together and the motorway. I am very aware as Councillor for Junction 9 at the M25 how some of these things fit together so could he actually do a seminar of briefing with that information because that was what we are looking for I think probably to actually make this sensible for a movie. If it is in fact a true consultation and if not what the key objections of that consultation process are. Thank you. What I want to say is I was involved many years ago when actually Epsom had three pumps and we had to go through all the malarkey of don't worry everybody now has got we won't have any more fires that was the best bit because we're so modern we won't have fires hey things like clothes get caught on cookers so we were told yes we're going to lose one and off it went up to Bansti where I have to say must declare an interest my family live there but the point is I haven't seen much activity there however we're only left with one pump down in Epsom and over the last few years we've been pushed and pushed to build more houses so therefore I know what's going to say all all the intellectual people say doesn't mean more houses you'll have more fires well I'm not waiting for that I'm not waiting for that rigmarole I want to make sure that what we have in place is sufficient and we've got one of the heaviest traffic loads throughout borough and therefore we can't always make the time but I appreciate it but really no one's come to me but my question is why did no one come to me as the world who or the member of the of Epsom who's been mostly involved over the years and they haven't this is the first I've knew I think I think I remember we've gone over time now could you like to respond to all these questions or would you do it I'm not sure I've written them all down and I've probably missed a few bits so just a couple of points I think counselor over and as you want to know about the 20 during the day and 16 appliances during the night there's no plans for that to change counselor Paul I'm happy to provide some additional information but I just need to remind you this is about it's about risk and not based on response times but I'm happy to provide you with that information Stephen you asked about Epsom I think it was you was asking about Epsom when you look at the risk of Epsom and a number of incidents and the risk there is no risk based evidence to say a second vehicle is required there it's based across the whole county not on the individual areas counselor all about the dynamic tool I think people are always welcome to go into Sorry Fine Rescue and have a look at the dynamic tool it's a live big screen where you can see where all the risks are and how vehicles are moved across the county to manage those risks but I'm happy if democratic services can find a space maybe you want to do a little briefing for all the different briefings I think it's a save time yeah please thank you yeah and we're running out of time and those questions will be sorry sorry sorry sorry sorry sorry sorry sorry sorry sorry sorry sorry sorry sorry for the same standing order as Eva Kingston raised earlier I've put out a question I raised the supplementary I think Councillor Diness has responded to all of those who supplemented to my supplementary but hasn't given me the courtesy of an answer to my question is it possible that he might try and answer my question too because normally I think you'd start with a person who who asks the supplementary go on to the others afterwards but you seem to miss me I think in this case we had quite a few supplementary's and what I'm saying is if you want to take that I did ask a question is it not possibly in this meeting to address the question answer to ask the supplementary answer for the person who actually asked the question in the first place rather than just everyone else I don't think that's fair Chair and is your space be chairing meeting to make sure fairness rules I ask you to intervene thank you have you got the supplementary from the Catholics okay I think was obviously about the banstead as you probably know the police station is likely to be sold so we have no control over that and as you know the actual fire station is not fit for purpose there's no yard for a cruise to do their drills which means they're then having to go to other fire stations to do that so they were away from the area just to do that there's nowhere for their personal protection equipment when it's got contaminants on and there's no facilities for different genders so one the fire station is not fit for purpose but two it doesn't match the risk of sorry and where the fire service should be so hopefully if there's any you want to take this off Chair may or request a written answer because that didn't actually answer the question I hope thank you can you do that on the yeah thank you thank you question four is from Kathleen Bart to Claire Curran Kathleen Bart do you have a supplementary I do thank you thank you for the answer I could you provide more information about how we have established that the majority of parents favor the the current terminally modeling thank you any other supplementary Claire yes chairman I'd be happy to do so question five is from Fiona Davidson to Claire Curran Fiona do you have a supplementary I do chair thank you to the cabinet member for her response I'd like to quote from NHS England's national framework which was published in April 2023 about autism assessment pathways it says universal equitable and timely access to autism assessment in every ICB is important for an undiagnosed autistic person access to personal understanding health care education social care reasonable adjustments in the workplace statutory protection from discrimination or benefits may be withheld for this reason it's important that ICB do not restrict or withhold access to an autism diagnosis for example because locally a decision has been made by health to conduct only a needs-based assessment barriers to a diagnosis increase a person's risk for poor outcomes in life would the cabinet member agree that the current mind works neuro diverse assessment and diagnosis process and practice effectively restricts and withholds access to an autism diagnosis thank you any other supplementary yes thank you chairman will the cabinet member agree with me that failing to intervene before a child is in crisis will affect that child for the rest of their lives will she also agree that anyone listening to the school heads SEM practitioners and parents who gave evidence at the recent joint meetings of the adults and health and children's committee would expect us to demand that mind works up their game and provide a much better service to children who need their help they should not make the service match the money available they should design a service that meets the needs and then we should all demand that central government properly funds that provision anything less makes a travesty of the slogan no one left behind thank you chairman chairman thank you chair i'll point out that this was a joint question of my self-wiz Fiona thank the cabinet member and leader for their responses and their recognition of the impact the backlogs and lack of capacity in the existing system are having on vulnerable children and their families and i ask the cabinet member and lead of their help to establish the effective governance of mind works that is clearly required George Potter thank you mr chairman um as some i know i am a person with autism and one of the things which is uh the fact which is quite remarkable that i've learned over years is that one of the reason why autism diagnosis is so difficult is because so many of the symptoms of autism are in this are so indistinguishable from PTSD and trauma responses and the reason for that of course is that basically sarti fails to produce any examples of a non-traumatized autistic person because of the way that sarti fails to adapt to it and to accommodate people who are different and a big part of that is the failings in the education system and particularly around diagnosis and failure to adapt would the cabinet member agree that at the moment the service as being provided is inflicting further trauma on children with autism by preventing them from getting the support that they need when they need it and as council white has said only supporting people when it's their will past the point of crisis Jonathan Essex we are running out of time so please thank you um may i have assurance that the council will through its role on on the integrated care board um raise this issue with the icb about rationing of access to mental health and that this rationing will end because it's entirely inconsistent with our promise to leave no one behind it sorry Claire you've got very limited thank you chairman i don't want any member in this chamber to be under any illusion that this is not one of the biggest concerns for the children's directorate one of our main priorities and we're working really hard with all system leaders across the health and the health service and other partners to resolve it i completely agree with all the points made and we i am the leader and i know our executive director are really focusing on on resolving these issues at the earliest possible opportunity for children for young people and their families thank you question six is from Robert Evans to David Lewis, Robert Evans your supplementary thank you very much chair yes i'd like to thank the cabinet member for his answer so in the three years colleagues since 2021 there have been 5,619 claims from sorry residents for damage under potholes that in itself probably a fraction of the actual number of occurrences there were and of those of the claims 581 have been successful and a total of 190,000 pounds paid out that represents just about 10 percent of the claims can i ask the cabinet member whether he considers the 90 percent of claims rejected as fraudulent claims if he doesn't consider that what criteria being used to judge what is a successful claim good water thank you just to expand slightly on that 10 percent refusal rate it is worth noting that at the moment the process for submitting a claim of compensation is incredibly onerous not least including multiple independent quotes before you get any work done exact measurements of the damage to your vehicle details of not just when it not just the day in which it happened but the precise time and the weather conditions and the direction of travel now many of these things may well - can we have a supplementary please - there's a question don't we many of these themselves be reasonable in isolation but as a whole they create a process which is very difficult and time-consuming and bureaucratic which will discourage many people from going all the way through with their claims will the cabinet member be reviewing the criteria required for somebody to seek compensation to improve the rate because as has been suggested i highly doubt that 90 percent of claims are fraudulent and it seems far more likely but only 10 percent of people are determined enough to see through a difficult process to the end so will that be reviewed please karen remember thank you chair and thank you uh co-oxel Evans for your supplementary question i don't believe that the 90 percent of claims which were unsuccessful were fraudulent in any way i think that clearly those claimants believed at the time that they submitted their claims that they had a good case and in any situation like this there are criteria that have to be met and clearly those claims didn't meet the criteria that's not to say they were fraudulent claims it simply means that there was a lack of knowledge in terms of what the criteria would be in terms of actually settling the claim um i think that um you know we do have a duty in this local authority uh to protect our finances to protect the money that's raised largely from our residents and and and and whilst it's quite right that we have a process in place to uh to settle claims where there is a a good case for it and and and the criteria met you know at the same time we simply can't have a process where every claim that's put in is paid out so i think that the the system that we have currently is is fair the criteria are published to my knowledge on the website and there are no plans to review those in terms of counselor potters um question i think the question um was was something around would the criteria be reviewed for compensation and the general complaint about the bureaucracy and complexity of of submitting a claim well these issues are complex if anyone has put in the claim to their insurance company they would know the the difficulties of of actually doing that and this is a similar type of process and so currently there are no plans uh to review the criteria for determining whether or not compensation will be paid thank you sir question service from Catherine Powell to Claire Cameron Catherine do you have a supplementary yes please chair i'd like to thank the candidate member for her long and detailed response i'm sure we're all very aware of the fact that the provision of the right places and the right type of places is really important given that there are several reports that have referenced in this report that may give the more detailed answers i'm really looking for to provide reassurance please can the cabinet member commit to sharing those reports thank you chair any other supplementary cabinet yes i'm happy to do section question ages from uh jonathan s6 to matt furnace uh jonathan do you have a supplementary um thank you i'm not sure whether it's arising though out to the answer or badly worded nature of my question um point b of the question what i was seeking to understand is the the road maintenance deficit in terms of how much money would be needed to restore the the road network up to its current condition but the answer talks about road maintenance defects as opposed to deficits and says it's not possible to provide an answer and i ask for that to be broken down between concrete roads and tarmac roads so we can see whether it's greater for concrete roads or not um and and also by bar and district which in part a has been noted as being more prevalent concrete roads in two boroughs and districts so if it's not possible to break it down now by concrete and flexible roads is it possible to show what the relative um road maintenance deficit or or whatever that right terminology is by bar and district so we can see whether it is equitable and equal across the county or differs in different places and would the councilor cabinet member agree with me that it would be useful to um create a very simple record perhaps at start of where the concrete roads are and then to apply that to that data set so we can see whether or not there is a greater deficit in maintaining good maintenance of our concrete roads as opposed to flexible roads and and there and and there by seeing where that where that lies across the county thank you uh thank you chairman um firstly i'm grateful to council sx for raising this question because there are a lot of councilors across sorry that have a large number of concrete roads within our divisions and this is a topic that is of interest both to us and our residents um i don't understand in the answer in the second line of the answer the first part of the answer saying we do not have a record of concrete roads how is there a fine milling process program run by highways without having a record of the concrete roads in sorry to which it applies um it then estimates that between five and ten percent of sorry roads are concrete well that could be between two and three hundred miles of roads and chairman those are mainly in residential areas i believe in roads of a and houses of a certain age where that was the construction um that was at the time and over the years particularly in the 70s and the 80s it became fashionable to cover those concrete roads in tarmac which simply to hear a question please yes so would the cabinet member agree to review this area give members more information about the five million milling process what is happening where and when and particularly liaise with divisional members who have concrete roads in their division and are more interested in this than the ones that don't met thank you chair thank you uh as well to to council for their supplementary um so council sx apologies we will we'll look at getting a breakdown of the cost of bringing up all roads to uh standard by district um for information it's probably within the region of three hundred six hundred million pounds um for a one off go across the entire three thousand miles of network and uh pavements that we have in the county so as you can see despite us putting in 76 million to 100 million a year we have still got a way to go but we are seeing an improvement there the number of potholes are coming down the number of defects are decreasing as well um in identifying the type of road as it does set out uh a lot of roads were actually made of concrete particularly in the north east section of the county um when these have been as councilor with them as just said uh tarmac over it has proved to be a bit of a challenge um however we can see what we can do about the breakdown between concrete and flexible what i will say is our costs to repair might be higher with concrete but we often have to repair a concrete road far fewer times uh it is a much more long-lasting uh material uh if the engineers have their way everything would be a concrete road which we do not want uh particularly from road noise and other aspects um councilor with them um i'll do my best to get all that that information that you are requesting um as i said it is challenged we do know of a number of areas of concrete road we wouldn't necessarily know of areas until it becomes an issue um but what we have said is we're no longer going to be tarmacing over concrete roads we will be looking to move forward with the fine milling uh because the two materials do not work together and uh it is just uh a failed cost that continues so any records that we have happily share them uh and we can do yet another member briefing on concrete milling we seems to do it every year but i'm happy to continue doing that uh just so members are aware of the options available thank you chair thank you uh question known from Catherine Bart um to much furnace Catherine Diosa fragmentary and please can we make these a supplementary note statements thank you thank you um i think the uh my supplementary question is based on the last sentence which says therefore could you review in including utility to works on minor roads uh which don't appear on the bulletin at the moment and uh also aren't communicated obviously to divisional members um and i note that uh there's uh there's advanced warning signage is usually placed on site and their promoters are often asked by the county council to to do letters please could we um do more with utility works on minor roads get them on the bulletins and uh perhaps letters could go out in every case and advanced warning signage in every case it would help very much thank you any other supplementary council furnace thank you chair thank you councilor for your supplementary question um i would fully recommend you sign up to one dot network to get an alert for all road works in your area um it is a free uh free account that anyone can apply for we encourage all residents to to sign up for that because you get instant alerts as soon as a permit is granted if it helps the reason we don't include any works which are all unlikely to cause a level of disruption is we have over 110,000 permits issued on our 3000 miles of road every year so as you can imagine those highway bulletins will become incredibly long uh and uh instead we would ask that if people are interested in their particular local area they do that we post the ones which we know are going to have some level of disruption um but i do encourage anyone to sign up to the the one dot network um if it helps uh a lot of the about 70 percent of our works on the network our utility works we only know about 30 percent uh a majority of that is broadband and uh water company and the minor road is mostly the broadband which tends to be in the pavement which i know does cause a number of issues. I need ten minutes left now so a question ten is from Kathleen Powell to Claire Coven catching the year's supplementary. Yes please Chair. I'd like to thank the cabinet member for her response but ask whether she has any concerns that schools in areas of deprivation where it would not be possible for parents and carers to transport their children are becoming vulnerable to closure and would also ask whether she is following up with central government regarding changes that might help us to support these areas. Thank you Chair. Any other supplementary Claire. Thank you Chairman. Yes as I said in my answer we're looking at the school organization plan again for next year and we are doing some very uh extensive work with schools about the sustainability of small schools across the county and the director of education and I were recently um we recently joined a seminar which was run by the Diocese of Guilford um particularly looking at the future and the viability of small church schools. The viability of schools generally particularly smaller schools is an issue which is um which is the viability of smaller schools generally is an issue across the whole country. There is a falling birth rate and um particularly small schools in rural areas is one which is recognized in many other counties and I talk to other peer members um about this issue um regularly and we are working as a southeast region to see what other strategies and what other initiatives we can take again working in partnership with schools with maths with school leaders again we cannot dictate action that schools take um they must do that themselves but it's very important that we all work together as a system to protect small schools because as we know particularly in rural schools village schools are the heart of a community and we do not want to be losing these valuable assets um that residents so value. Question 11 is from Catherine Barte to Claire Cameron Catherine do you have a supplementary? I do thank you um is it possible to share the cost of the places that we're talking about I note that the the answer states that they would be prohibitive for families um it would be interesting to provide the families with that cost in some circumstances in certain circumstances um so an idea of the cost uh which is deemed prohibitive would be helpful thank you for any other supplementary Claire um I will lead to liaison to the service about this to see if this is um whether this will be information that they will be prepared to share with families and there might be commercial interests around this with contracted providers but I will lead us with the service to see if that's possible. Catherine um question 12 is from Catherine Powell to Claire Cameron Catherine Powell do you have a? Thank you chair I'd like to thank the cabinet member for her response however she will have received an email as I did from the Surrey County Fostering Association overnight in response to the responses provided this includes the following statement there seems to be some misunderstanding or you have been misinformed as when comparing the contents of the on the Surrey website and the charter presented at the corporate parenting board there are still significant differences and they also shared a comparison which the cabinet member has a copy of and I can provide another copy of if it would help well the cabinet member please commit to working with me and the Surrey County Fostering Association and the Fostering Service to resolve this inconsistency to drive a positive far forward on what is an utterly critical issue for attracting new foster carers and retaining existing ones thank you chair. Can you hear the supplementary Claire? Thank you and yes of course I recognize the the value that foster carers have to this organization they are the backbone of our care system and we owe them a tremendous debt of gratitude for the difference they make to children's lives and I hope that every member in this chamber will join me in extending that voter thanks to them I know there have been difficulties in in resolving this issue and that perhaps there have been a bit of a catalog of errors but I will certainly take this forward with the service I want to get this resolved as quickly as possible and to be able to move forward with the foster carers association in the most possible in the most positive possible collaboration to get this the get this charter live and working at the event last week I was able to extend my personal apologies to the leadership of the foster carers association for for the unfortunate errors and the fact that we weren't able to collectively to sign this document in the way that we wanted to and to celebrate and champion the work of our foster carers during this really important foster care fortnight which I hope all members have had the opportunity to engage with the fostering service at different places around the county thank you Jim. Thank you question 13 is from Catherine Bart to Marissa Heath Catherine Bart your supplementary? I do thank you I'd like to I know Marissa is not here at the moment I'd like to thank her for her answer I note that we've been the county council has been awarded bronze level for carbon literacy there are that's the that's the base level there is a platinum level and my question is have we got an ambition to achieve platinum level and a plan to get there thank you. Any other supplementary leader will you have to pick this? Thank you Chair. Marissa Heath it's the best place to answer that but I'm sure we do have that ambition and I'll find out exactly where we are on that journey. Should we go for gold? Item 16 is stated by members I have received two statements from members there was a time limit of two minutes per statement and these are put without discussion or reply. I'll call Jonathan Halley to make a short statement. Thank you Mr Chairman. In November of 2023 Tara Wales a constituent of mine was on the verge of a physical and emotional breakdown unable to find the supported living accommodation in Surrey so desperately needed for her son Joshua a 24 year old who cannot care for himself cannot wash or clothe himself is unable to feed himself the stresses and strains on Tara and her family having to look after him while also having to solve some secure alternative accommodation was taking its toll. But in stepped two unsung heroes of this authority Melanie Hall and Amy Verrill of the West Learning Disability and Autism team part of the all-aged learning disability directorates who like to celestial being stepped in and worked tirelessly to source accommodation for Joshua even helping to negotiate the tenancy agreement and working to secure the funding that they needed including funding for new furniture provision. Now Mr Chairman at the Royal Hill Park complex in Red Hill Joshua has now found a new home and Tara and her family have new hope for a better future for their son. This would not have been possible without the support of Melanie and Amy and they Mr. Chairman will simply say that they have been doing their job. I will say to you this morning maybe so but I want to say here today thank you thank you to both of you you have made a lasting difference to one family in Surrey and for that Tara, Joshua and I are eternally grateful thank you. I now call on Steve McCormack to make his state. Thank you Chair. At this AGM the start of our municipal municipal year I wanted us to consider a reflect on the unintended consequences that decisions made and actions taken have on each verse and our residents as we go about our daily lives. Specifically the chalk pit a waste transfer and processing site on the board of my division and it sits in John Beckett's division. Planning permission was granted for a change of use of his site and since that time residents in the local area have borne the consequences of that decision. The building to contain the waste processing and to mitigate the noise and dust is still not complete and is in fact party to a change of planning conditions which will come before committee in the coming months. All activities have continued since the original planning permission was granted with a continued noise and disturbance to residents. The increased presence of heavy good vehicles has led to substantial rise in the traffic volume. This will not only cause congestion but also increase for likelihood of accidents posing a risk to the safety of our residents and especially pedestrians and cyclists. Secondly the surge in HDV traffic will accelerate for wear and tear on our road network. Our local roads are not designed to handle such heavy and frequent loads. We'll deteriorate faster leading to more potholes and surface damage. This will necessitate more frequent and costly repairs. Furthermore the constant noise and air pollution from these large vehicles would degrade in the quality of life our residents. Noise pollution can lead to increased stress and health issues with emissions contributing to air pollution, exacerbating respiratory problems and impacting overall public health. In conclusion while the development of a waste transfer and processing centre may offer certain benefits we must carefully weigh these against the significant negative impacts on our road infrastructure and the well-being of our residents. It is crucial that we consider the unintended consequences and explore alternative solutions that do not compromise the safety and quality of life in our community. Thank you Chair. Item 17 is the report of the cabinet pages 71 to 76th of the agenda. I call the leaders present the report of the meeting cabinet held on the 26th of March and 23rd of April 24th. Thank you very much Chair. I beg to move the reports of the cabinet to say held on the 26th of March and 23rd of April 2024. There were no reports for the recommendation for Council. Reports for information discussion 26th of March are called Paragraph A to B. Called Paragraph A, service structure plane raises five schemes. Called Paragraph B, Chezzington Primary School roof replacement works. 23rd of April I called Paragraph C to E. Called Paragraph C, Kalamajipc, Roma Travellers Camp Woking. Called Paragraph D, your fund survey, the Hazelmeal Link Community Hub. Paragraph E, Ashwell Community Development Meeting Place and New Scout Headquarters. I'll call Paragraph F, quarterly report on discussions taken under special urgency arrangements tells the March 2024 and turning the March 2024. The cabinet recommends that the County Council know that there has been one urgent discussion since the last cabinet report to the Council. Chezzington Primary School roof replacement works cabinet 26th of March 2024. Following discussion on the above, the motion is that the report of the meeting of the cabinet held on the 26th of March 2024 and 23rd of April 24th will be adopted. How we agreed? Minutes of the cabinet meeting, pages 77 to 96, I now turn to the final item agenda today and no notification to make statement question on the minutes has been received. This brings us to the conclusion of the meeting. I'd like to thank all the members for taking part. Lunch is provided for members and CLT. Please do join me in the subject. I look forward to seeing you all there. Please follow staff instructions. Thank you. [BLANK_AUDIO]